2257 Question Regarding Free Sponsor Content

Just a question there is alot of content availiable for use via sponsors, I actually downloaded some of this content fully expecting it to come with relevant documentation regarding 2257 regulation and to my suprise there was none.

I have since visited several other sponsor programs and found exactly the same thing occured.

If i was to use this content to promote their sites am i not in breach of 2257 regulations.

Just thought it might be something worth a mention.

I so far have found nothing on those sites that even allows me the ability to say that the correct documentation is held with the custodian at __________

And even if I did should I not at least site this documentation before proceeding to use it?

I had the same question when building our first site, and wrote one of the sponsors and asked about how I would either obtain a license, or how to show legal use in the 2257. They replied that in the terms of use when you first signup with the sponsor it covers giving you a blanket "permission" to use the images to promote their sites, and that I didn't need to "do anything". I still wonder about that answer, and curious to see what others have to say about it.

Hey BentBoy, welcome to the forums! Long time to chat, hee hee. :)

You have a very good point there. I don't think you should ever use content without having the proper 2257 issues handled. And LdyLnWolf1, the site that gave you the content may have given you 'permission' to use the content, but then again, I could give you 'permission' to walk out of a department store with a brand new shirt without paying for it, but that doesn't make it legal.

Without saying WHICH sponsor this is (but it's a biggie), here's the original email response I got back: (name blanked with xx's)

Dear Webmaster,

The following is from our terms:

"We grant to You, the following:
1.2 A limited nonexclusive, nontransferable and revocable license to access and download promotional banners, and other promotional materials created by xxxx XXXXX for use on Your Website for the exclusive purpose of advertising, marketing or promoting websites owned, controlled and/or operated by XXX., Inc.; however, the license herein granted shall automatically and immediately cease upon the termination of this Agreement."

In effect we give our webmasters license. You don't need to do anything.

Hmmm, well I'm not a lawyer and I can't give legal advice. I do know that you can use as your custodian of records because we hold all the model releases, but we give them to you too, so you could use yourselves. Some people still use us even though they hold the records and that's fine. I don't know how it works with sponsors but I would think that you would have access to the model release information if you are using the content on your site. You may want to ask someone about that. Do we have anyone legal consultants here or someone who could help LdyLnWolf1 out?

I am at present doing a little reasearch on this matter and perhaps to make it easier for us all any sponsor that does in fact offer content compleate with full 2257 documentation might post here to make the going a little easier for us all.

I'm happy to build sites for sponsors promoting their sites provided my back is covered with the correct documentation.

I do think that this is an important issue that all people new to the industry should be aware of.

Thanks for the welcome don I'm very happy to say I hope to stick around on this board.

Gary has done an awesome job of it thanks for providing such a great forum Garry.

If anyone knows of a sponsor that makes it easy in that when you download content from them they provide full documentation with the download let us know here.

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Originally posted by Ounique
Hmmm, well I'm not a lawyer and I can't give legal advice. I do know that you can use as your custodian of records because we hold all the model releases, but we give them to you too, so you could use yourselves. Some people still use us even though they hold the records and that's fine. I don't know how it works with sponsors but I would think that you would have access to the model release information if you are using the content on your site. You may want to ask someone about that. Do we have anyone legal consultants here or someone who could help LdyLnWolf1 out?

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I think that the big point that im makeing is

1. If you purchase a licence via ounique for example you have full licence to use the content,

2. You recieve copies of model release documentation.

ie: Physical proof of the existance of the documentation.

You should surely get the same from any sponsor program allowing you to use free content owned by them.

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Originally posted by BentBoy
Thanks for the welcome don I'm very happy to say I hope to stick around on this board.

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BentBoy,

You can stick around for as long as you want to, and I hope you stay sticky for a long time. :cool:

BentBoy, for sponsor links/banners, etc, I always just put a link in my 2257 section to their 2257 page.

What you have to remember is no one as of yet has been prosecuted for violating 18 USC 2257 and there is a lot of speculation about Internet content and what types of sites need the information.

When I buy content, I always get a license, even if some sites (Ounique, I believe) now say it's not needed. I still print one out and make sure the 2257 information is in there.

Then again, I put 2257 information on galleries :)

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Originally posted by rick
1. BentBoy, for sponsor links/banners, etc, I always just put a link in my 2257 section to their 2257 page.

2. Then again, I put 2257 information on galleries :)

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Hi Rick I think These are both good point's This is the type of input that i was trying to encourage.

Question on point 1 : Do you physically site this documentation if you dont physically see the documentation or proof that the sponsor holds this documentation who is responsable under regulation and is there not a risk there.

I would think if the content is hosted on your servers that ultimatly you would be first port of call if there was an issue correct me if im wrong.

On Point 2: I personally have never used sponsor content only ever purchased content or content produced by our company. Its very important I think to always place 2257 info on any site you create at the very least whom you need to contact to gain access to these records.

I suppose I'm just not comfortable to go ahead useing any content that I dont physically have access to required documentation.

Thankyou very much for the input.

It would be great to get someone with specific legal knowledge to post on this subject and/or responces from sponsors that offer free content.

On your comment regarding no-one ever being procecuted under 2257 I dont think this negates that possiability at all.

If they dont provide you with 2257 documentation, then it doesnt have to conform to the 2257 rules.

So, if you have a disclaimer on your site, that all content is in accordance to 2257, you cant use that content.

Many sites do not have the 2257 disclaimer, its not an absolute necessity. Many providers/affiliate programs are from Eastern Europe, Russia, and they mostly dont conform to 2257. They dont have to - they are not American and typically dont use American cc processors.

My sites all have only 2257 content, but I do not put any sign on any site that says its 2257 compliant.

Get a lawyer and translate that article into plain English - and you'll get a little suprise. And I dont agree with some of the stuff in there, it simply goes way too far. Yes all models are over 18, yes there is no kp on there, but no Im not going to let ANYONE who wants to, walk in my front door to inspect my records. sorry. Big Brother can go fcuk himself.

On my site, I have a 2257 disclaimer page that says that I own all of the material on the site and I refer them to the keeper of the records at Ounique. I remember some TriTech person writing an article about this and saying that I actually don't need to give anyone the records, just refer them to the people from who I bought them.

In cases of free stuff I get from other affiliate programs, I do the same. "There galleries are owned by these people contact them here."

But I sure would love some authority or clarification on this issue. I don't really expect any issue because you'd have to be off your rocker to try and prosecute me for not having records on someone who is clearly 40 year old and hairier than God.

Furthermore, on this issue, I have to say that I'm thrilled with Ounique in the ID and documentation department. I'm just working on a new twink gallery with some pics I got some some European company shot by some guy in Bulgaria. Where are the docs? Where's the ID? You guessed it.

With Ounique it's always there. Once I bought a set from Ounique and there was no ID picture (but there was a signed contract) no problem, they replaced the set, and even pulled it from circulation until they could sort it out. I doubt I'll be getting the same service when I contact these other people and try and sort this out.

So, my recommendation before you buy from a new supplier is to buy a test set and see what they ID and contract documentation is like. If it's bad, it ain't worth the risk.

Cheers,
Dzinerbear

The other thing I forgot to mention on this thread, is that having the proper documentation, i.e. and a signed contract with the photographer, has helped me enormously to sell other affiliates on my site.

First, in some cases knowing a guy's nationality is actually a plus, at least for one of my sites because it's all eastern European based guys. So, I don't have to lie, bullshit, or guess.

Second, so many of these pictures are stills taken during a movie shoot, so when I have a signed contract with a photographer, I get the model's stage name (usually) which helps me with search engine traffic; and often, the name of the movie is listed as well, so then I can say, "Come and rent this movie at MANcheck Cinema with so-and-so, and here are some of his other movies."

So at least when you get legitimate documentation, you have a starting point ... remember the thread of "what inspires you"?

Cheers
Dzinerbear

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Second, so many of these pictures are stills taken during a movie shoot, so when I have a signed contract with a photographer, I get the model's stage name (usually) which helps me with search engine traffic; and often, the name of the movie is listed as well, so then I can say, "Come and rent this movie at MANcheck Cinema with so-and-so, and here are some of his other movies."

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Excellent point ... and any leverage you can find can't hurt!

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Originally posted by rick
When I buy content, I always get a license, even if some sites (Ounique, I believe) now say it's not needed. I still print one out and make sure the 2257 information is in there.

Then again, I put 2257 information on galleries :)

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Hey Rick. Nice to see you here. Actually, at Ounique we have our license available on the site. The client clicks on an agreement to the license and is provided with an Invoice upon purchase that works as your license. Not automatically giving you the contract is just a means of saving paper. It's always available if you want it. The contract doesn't chage. But the invoice is the important thing. You always should have a copy of that. :)