So Has AVN Made A Statement Yet?

[Lee]

Good for you. Just don't come onto the boards bitching about private parties being thrown last week when YOU, in fact, are guilty of the same behavior. Because if you're going to pretend to be a moral superior, then your hands should be pretty clean.

Ken,

Im not bitching about private parties being thrown. You seem to have started that topic up for some reason, my guess is to subvert the direction of this thread away from getting AVN to answer why the non-compete clause was put in the contract to stop CCBill from sponsoring your event later this year.

To which, it has been almost 4 weeks without an answer, someone at AVN sure does want to gain the respect of the gay industry... By ignoring these questions that many of us still have, and would like answers to.

Regards,

Lee

[Dzinerbear]

Yes, but if you're so focused on ethics and morals and not aligning yourselves with scumbags, then you should be held up to the standards that you purport on the boards.

No Ken, what I'm focused on is that your company is a part of a group of companies that decided that rather than supporting an existing gay show -- and a very good one -- that they needed to have one of their own. And in spite of an outcry on this board from the webmasters who said they didn't want another gay show, you scheduled one for a month after the show that the community was looking forward to.

What I am focused on his that AVN continues to put on bad shows but feels the need to enlarge their show roster. Why don't you clean up the two you already have and make them better?

What I am focused on is that an LA-based magazine who is losing their grip on the perceived power they thought they had, constantly involves themselves in tearing apart this community.

That's what I'm focused on. Oh that, and bumping this thread as much as possible so I can get closer to winning that $78,000 in prizes for the 200,000th contest.

Michael

[Dzinerbear]

Im not bitching about private parties being thrown. You seem to have started that topic up for some reason,

No, that was me who started that one.

Michael

[Lee]

No, that was me who started that one.

Michael

Oh okay, glad someone mentioned it at least

Regards,

Lee

[XXXWriterDude]

Ken,

Im not bitching about private parties being thrown. You seem to have started that topic up for some reason, my guess is to subvert the direction of this thread away from getting AVN to answer why the non-compete clause was put in the contract to stop CCBill from sponsoring your event later this year.

So the following post wasn't made by you then?

Originally Posted by Lee
You certainly arent mis-informed.

Personally i found the whole attitude from those that were being petty at the show to be nothing less than childish because they couldnt get their own way.

Arranging 'private invite only' parties that started 30 minutes prior to the officially sponsored events and having the balls to have people picked up right outside the hotel whilst not showing your face the entire show.

As i have mentioned elsewhere in this thread, for a group of companies constantly telling the gay webmaster community they want unity, they did a lot of splintering of the community at Phoenix.

Regards,

Lee

Anyway, as I've pointed out, it's clear that there is a lot of convenient morality and hypocrisy being tossed about here, which, as far as I'm concerned, deflates most of your arguments--and certainly invalidates your self-righteousness. I've said just about all that I can say, so you just keep bumping your little thread and MAYBE you'll get someone to respond to your name-calling theatrics. I've done my part. God give me the strength to not respond to this nonsense again.

[gaybucks_chip]

Um,

It seems to me that several people are starting to just get nasty with one another, and that helps no one.

Ken, thanks for your kind words. I do put a lot of my heart into everything I do, and I do want what's best for the community as a whole, and believe that, with very few exceptions, what's good for my company is good for the industry as a whole and vice versa. Not asking anyone else to follow my lead, not even saying my choices are the "right" or "best" ones, only that they're best for me and hopefully for my company.

I was thunderstruck to read that the retreat is a no-admission-fee event. I can't believe I missed that point before, and it does make a significant difference to me, because one of my strongest objections to the SF show was the admission fee that would have the effect of keeping the smaller-budget webmasters away. So taking that step is extremely meaningful toward helping to create community, and I applaud AVN for it.

Perhaps AVN truly is not the main creator of the problem that's being discussed here. But if that's the case, then AVN could do an amazing job of ingratiating itself to the community by speaking about it, acknowledging who really was responsible for choosing a date in competition with another event, and then taking a public stance supporting cooperation and openness to all in the future. Epoch could do the same. But neither has said anything officially.

Yes, there's been a lot of infighting, name calling, innuendo, and inaccuracy in this thread. But that doesn't negate the need for truth, particularly from a company whose entire business is based on communicating to the community.

To the extent that I have been responsible for providing or perpetrating *any* inaccurate or misleading information, I apologize to all concerned, and I continue to stand ready to publicly acknowledge any errors in any statements I've made. But in order to do that, I need to know the facts, and the information provided has to be credible.

No matter how many times anyone says "We chose the month for the show because it was the best possible month," NO ONE believes that. It simply isn't credible, it's too much of a coincidence. People in the triad (and the various members of their choir that keep popping up randomly to post in this thread and then disappear) keep whispering about there being "much more" involving CCBill, Ron Cadwell, Cybersocket, and others... but no one will provide the complete picture.

If CCBill has pulled off a PR coup and is really the villain here, then for God sakes, somebody in the know needs to say that.

If somebody strongarmed AVN to choose the date they chose, then for God sakes say that.

If it was supposed to be a joint event but CCBill wouldn't play ball, or somebody didn't want to play ball with CCBill, or somebody decided they wanted to be in control and couldn't be because it was a CCBill event, then for God sakes say that.

I'd much rather have someone show up and say "Look here's how it went down" without the PR speak and mutual brownnosing. It might suck and it might make one or all four companies involved look bad, but it would bring closure and people could move on.

It is simply the lack of clear, plausible explanation that is prolonging the agony.

And btw, I have never said that I will not attend the Retreat. For me, there are too many questions unanswered questions at this point to be able to make a decision, and regardless of my personal feelings, Gaybucks decision to support the event will be a joint decision between AJ and I based on the information that becomes available at the time we need to make the decision.

[Xstr8guy]

You're all a bunch of bitchy mean girls!

STOP IT!

[Lee]

Still no answers?

Who would have guessed

Regards,

Lee