So Has AVN Made A Statement Yet?

[XXXWriterDude]

And I think that since you've pointed that out, several posters have changed the tone of what they've been saying. Yet, they are still greeted with stony silence. And as you've said above, apparently AVN believes that stony silence is the right way to handle the situation, so therefore, it wouldn't matter how friendly and charming the thread is, there still would not have been any answers.

Actually, it's not about silence; it's more about not getting embroiled in flame wars on a message board. I just don't think that posting on a message board where--to be frank--a good portion of the posters aren't even those who attend the shows in the first place will do anybody any good. I should have taken their example and just not gotten involved in this at all, actually. At some point you just have to rise above it all. Because, in the end, this thread is really just a lot of board drama being perpetuated by people with way too much time on their hands. Talking to people in person at the Phoenix Forum last week, I got a much clearer understanding of the opinions out there, and this board seems to represent a small faction of those opinions.

You're a decent guy, Chip, with a lot of heart. That much is obvious. And of course, I agree with you that it IS possible for companies to work together in this space. The GAYVN Retreat show, regardless of what you might think, is, in fact, a representation of the way that companies can come together to work for the good of the industry. Admittedly, the details of how the show came about may be unfortunate, but in the end, I think those who are able to see past all the controversy and the board drama will, in fact, see the benefit in attending the show. If the show's a bomb, then we were wrong. I'll guess we'll find out come October.

Go if you want to go, or don't go. It's up to you. That's the freedom that YOU have to conduct business the way that YOU see fit.

[Dzinerbear]

Actually, you were. AVN was NOT involved in any off-site parties that conflicted with those being thrown on the Forum grounds. I didn't even know they were happening until after the fact, when people mentioned it to me. So much for us being part of the alleged "Gay Mafia."

Actually I didn't say that "all" members of the Triad, I said, "some." Thanks for clearing up that AVN wasn't involved with that. Maybe AVN should choose their bedfellows more carefully, sometimes when you sleep with dogs you get fleas.

Michael

[Lee]

I didn't read the entire thread back but I don't think I said anything like that, nor do I condone that sort of name calling. However, at a certain point, disingenuous statements do tend to speak for themselves, and whether stated or not, many people may feel what one person stated.

I probably said it, i know thats what i think of AVN as a company and its not a word a lot of people use freely

Non the less, if the cap fits....

Regards,

Lee

[XXXWriterDude]

You certainly arent mis-informed.

Personally i found the whole attitude from those that were being petty at the show to be nothing less than childish because they couldnt get their own way.

Arranging 'private invite only' parties that started 30 minutes prior to the officially sponsored events and having the balls to have people picked up right outside the hotel whilst not showing your face the entire show.

As i have mentioned elsewhere in this thread, for a group of companies constantly telling the gay webmaster community they want unity, they did a lot of splintering of the community at Phoenix.

Regards,

Lee

Um, Lee, have you forgotten that just last January, you threw your own little non-show-aligned parties at another hotel during our Internext show??? How is that any different?

I probably said it, i know thats what i think of AVN as a company and its not a word a lot of people use freely

Non the less, if the cap fits...

Again, you seriously need to stop with the name-calling. I'd love to know what your personal beef with AVN is all about. Because, for the life of me, it doesn't seem as if you have a legitimate beef beyond the fact that we are a company who charges admission to some of our shows.

And honestly, if you thought we were such scumbags, then why did you IM me every time you had a new promotion you wanted press for, or agree to talk to me for all the stories I wrote about your program? I mean, isn't that just a little bit hypocritical of you? You certainly weren't complaining whenever we were giving you FREE press.

Oh, and, by the way, though several people have overlooked this fact, we are not charging admission to our October show. Again, for the hard of hearing, it's a free show.

[Lee]

Um, Lee, have you forgotten that just last January, you threw your own little non-show-aligned parties at another hotel during our Internext show??? How is that any different?

Um, i think you must be mistaking me for someone else Ken as i didnt do Vegas in January, in fact, the Phoenix Forum was the first show ive attended in about two years i think

Regards,

Lee

[XXXWriterDude]

Um, i think you must be mistaking me for someone else Ken as i didnt do Vegas in January, in fact, the Phoenix Forum was the first show ive attended in about two years i think

Regards,

Lee

January 2006, Lee. Which was just a year and a half ago.

[Lee]

January 2006, Lee. Which was just a year and a half ago.

Ah, well strictly speaking i didnt do the 'show' in fact, Gary and I never left our hotel but, yeah, if you want to split hairs ill give you that

Was a good time for sure, especially as it wasnt part of Internext officially after you guys decided to screw us over in 2005 with a booth that never got used and afterwards your mafia 'friends' starting acting up about our parties saying we werent even show sponsors.

Nope, cant think of any reasons why i would consider your company scum, especially after paying out thousands of dollars in booth fees and not getting any clarification from you [AVN] when companies paying more started throwing the dirt around because our events were more successful than theirs.

Regards,

Lee

[Lee]

You certainly weren't complaining whenever we were giving you FREE press.

For the record, you might want to double check on that

Ive been saying for years that AVN is a money grabbing, scum sucking company, i guess its only in the last 12-18 months while you have been on GWW that you or AVN bothered paying any attention to it, no suprise there

But anyway, back to the original topic, we going to be graced with Chads presence to explain why the non-compete was put in to effect specifically stopping CCBill from sponsoring your event later this year, or is he going to continue ignoring this thread like it doesnt exist?

Regards,

Lee

[Dzinerbear]

And honestly, if you thought we were such scumbags, then why did you IM me every time you had a new promotion you wanted press for, or agree to talk to me for all the stories I wrote about your program? I mean, isn't that just a little bit hypocritical of you? You certainly weren't complaining whenever we were giving you FREE press.

Um ... didn't someone say something earlier about business being business or doing what is good for your business?

Michael

[XXXWriterDude]

Ah, well strictly speaking i didnt do the 'show' in fact, Gary and I never left our hotel but, yeah, if you want to split hairs ill give you that

Was a good time for sure, especially as it wasnt part of Internext officially after you guys decided to screw us over in 2005 with a booth that never got used and afterwards your mafia 'friends' starting acting up about our parties saying we werent even show sponsors.

Nope, cant think of any reasons why i would consider your company scum, especially after paying out thousands of dollars in booth fees and not getting any clarification from you [AVN] when companies paying more started throwing the dirt around because our events were more successful than theirs.

Well, that I may have to look into. It's not something I'm aware of. I'm glad you finally stated the nature of your problem. That's what adults do, instead of making nasty unfounded accusations on public forums.

And you WEREN'T a show sponsor in 2006, Lee, so--even if you do have personal beef with us (whether justified or not) from 2005--you shouldn't be throwing your own little off-site parties to siphon off our show traffic. Because, honestly, how is that any different than what happened at the Forum last week? Because you were mad at us from the year before, it made it OK?

[Lee]

Um ... didn't someone say something earlier about business being business or doing what is good for your business?

Michael

Thats only the case when it benefits THEM surely you knew that by now

Regards,

Lee

[XXXWriterDude]

Um ... didn't someone say something earlier about business being business or doing what is good for your business?

Michael

Yes, but if you're so focused on ethics and morals and not aligning yourselves with scumbags, then you should be held up to the standards that you purport on the boards.

[Lee]

Well, that I may have to look into. It's not something I'm aware of. I'm glad you finally stated the nature of your problem. That's what adults do, instead of making nasty unfounded accusations on public forums.

Ken,

AVN was aware of this, Aly even said she would 'look in to it' but alas, nothing ever came of it.

And you WEREN'T a show sponsor in 2006, Lee

I never said i was, but thanks for clarifying that. In fact, i dont think i even registered for the show, and we still got business done and had some awesome afterhour parties

Regards,

Lee

[Lee]

Yes, but if you're so focused on ethics and morals and not aligning yourselves with scumbags, then you should be held up to the standards that you purport on the boards.

Ken,

I dont align myself with scumbags, or companies who have ethics or morals that arent the same (or very similar) to mine.

You dont see me fucking over the gay webmaster community to line my pockets with money or to further my own agenda while trying to hold on for dear life to the shred of percieved value that remains.

Bottom line, i tell it like it is, and i wont do business with just anybody, i think ive proven that over the years on GWW, AVN on the other hand...

But again this thread is vearing off topic...

Why was that non-compete clause put in the show contract to stop CCBill from sponsoring it?

Regards,

Lee

[XXXWriterDude]

I never said i was, but thanks for clarifying that. In fact, i dont think i even registered for the show, and we still got business done and had some awesome afterhour parties

Good for you. Just don't come onto the boards bitching about private parties being thrown last week when YOU, in fact, are guilty of the same behavior. Because if you're going to pretend to be a moral superior, then your hands should be pretty clean.