Derogatory use of the word "gay"

[gaystoryman]

It is interesting, the idea that eventually the term will lose its mean spirit is to me, unreal really.

Simply because the term '******' or 'so gay' or whatever might be less likely to garner objection by society doesn't make it any less demeaning, less hurtful. The words are used to set aside a group in a negative light, whether intentional or not, and as long as people who are affected by such words remain silent, the abuse will & does continue.

There is an old adage, 'think before you speak' and it seems that today, just like common sense, thinking before one speaks has gone dormant. If people don't stand up for what they feel is insulting, how can they then expect others to rise up and defend them when it becomes more serious?

[Jasun]

I'm always, like, "What are you? In junior high still?" It's an immature form of speak to begin with. Its negative social connotations are just icing on the cake.

Either way you cut it, it's just bad form.

Well, and that's the crux of the whole thing. I grew up thinking that "gay" meant "mentally retarded" and that all mentally retarded people were gay... I even thought that gay people were mildly retarded.. it was a sliding scale.. the more retarded you got the gayer you were.

Ok, I wasn't the brightest bulb, but I was 6.

My point is the same as Ken's i think... wether they mean it to be negative or not, it is. And I've heard it a million times from people that "I don't mean it like that..." and I simply say "then find a word that conveys what you meant a little better, please."

[XXXWriterDude]

It is interesting, the idea that eventually the term will lose its mean spirit is to me, unreal really.

Simply because the term '******' or 'so gay' or whatever might be less likely to garner objection by society doesn't make it any less demeaning, less hurtful. The words are used to set aside a group in a negative light, whether intentional or not, and as long as people who are affected by such words remain silent, the abuse will & does continue.

There is an old adage, 'think before you speak' and it seems that today, just like common sense, thinking before one speaks has gone dormant. If people don't stand up for what they feel is insulting, how can they then expect others to rise up and defend them when it becomes more serious?

Excellent points, buddy.

Like some who have posted on here, I don't personally take offense when someone says "that's so gay" or "that's so queer." But I do point out to them that they should not use "gay" or "queer" in those contexts, because it sends a message that you think those things are negative things. Again, regardless of someone's intent in using the phrase, some form of negativity is implied.

I think that anyone who believes in community empowerment has a RESPONSIBILITY to help eliminate these phrases. Words have incredible power in our community, and ignoring it when people use certain words in a negative light is, in a very indirect way, contributing to things like homophobia and racism. You may not look at it that way, but it doesn't mean that's not what is happening. When you ignore someone using the word "gay" in a derogatory way (REGARDLESS of whether they mean it toward gay people or not), you are indirectly condoning hate speech, just as using archaic words like "fireman" or "police man" or "mail man" means that you are condoning sexism.

Plain and simple, the negative roots of the terms "gay" and "queer" begin with an association with the gay community, and to me, that makes them unacceptable. And my personal opinion is that, even if you yourself are not personally offended by the use of such terms, you should be helping to educate people in not using the terms. In the long run, phrases like these are and will continue to be harmful to our community--and especially to our community's youth--as long as they go unchecked and tolerated.

[Madame0120]

Words do hurt, and it is too bad too many don't stand up when words are used in a way that are demeaning or insulting. :thumbsup:

I stand up! As will the boy we raised to manhood.

But just like everything else in this world - only the ignorant knuckleheads are heard. However, in MY Home - hate is not allowed, and never ignored.

For 6 years I've watched my son's circle of Friends grow into fine young men. For some we may be the only voice of reason and tolerance in their lives and pray that they remember the Lessons taught by example in our happy Home.

A Mother like me may be called traditional, yet it is anything but. Never working outside the home while raising my child, is a luxury I will always be grateful for. I may never know what it feels like to get that next great promotion, recieve a pay raise or given awards for a job well done. No, Moms like me stand a quiet watch, looking for the small signs her daily care has had impact. Hard years of doing without material things so I could stay at home and be a traditional Wife, melted away the day I got my sign.

There was a new kid was in the wake of the usual after school invastion of noisy boy-things, nothing but big feet and hungry bellies wanting to know why I had to wait to cut the "stupid pan of brownies". They wandered off, none of them interested in my lesson on the physics of cooking and I heard the new one pipe up, That's So GAY. Before I could turn around to explain the Rules of The House to our new guest .. the rest of them jumped all over this poor kid - No words could be sweeter or fill me with more Pride than a 14 year old saying, "Shit man, better Watch out .. cause She will kick your ass if she hears you say that." "Yeah butthead, don't mess up, I'm hungry."

That was my reward, award and validation all rolled into one. There is no job or cause, not a car, big house or thing on this earth that could mean more to me than that moment. Knowing that not just my son, but the rest of the crew of- "my boys" - understood the full lesson of tolerance that is only complete when a person speaks up against bigotry, in all it's forms.

[MWCren]

I've been killing myself trying to remember when "thats so gay" sorta "took off" as common. Then it hit me... South Park. Those little imps constantly use it. Now, I realize South Park doesn't descriminate.. they throw out every rule book on political correctness, but seems to me "thats so gay" gets a lot of air time.

I'm really sorta surprised too. You know they have more than a few gay writers on the staff.. how else could they come up with Mr. Garrison and Mr. Slave!

Think of other phrases from that show that have really been over-used.. how about the superlative "hella", or "weak" or "lame". I don't know if they reflect the labels that are already out there, or if they enforce them and encourage mimicry. Kids that use those phrases probably don't even know what it means. They heard it on South Park, so its "cool".

[Madame0120]

Then it hit me... South Park. Those little imps constantly use it.

The day I heard the word dildo come out of the mouth of a cartoon on my TV, it was forbidden in my Home. But Maaaaaa ..
Tough shit .. go to Brian's house if you wana watch that crap.

Ask me again .. and your cable is gone.

End of subject

Are we the last FAmily on earth with RULES?

[collegeboyslive]

but other than homosexual, as in "that's so gay". The main idea of the thread was that most people who use the word do not intend it to be derogatory towards gay people, it's just become a word that means something different now, so it's use is pretty much okay.

I even hear gay people say this. which i really find to be funny, in a sad sorta way

[SLS]

When I see/hear/read something that is extremely for/by homosexuals, sometimes my first reaction will be to say "that's so gay." I've heard "that's so punk rock", "that's so ghetto", "that's so emo" etc etc, meaning the same thing, "thats for/by a specific group"
But yeah, when people start using it as a general catchall for everything they dont like, it annoys the fuck out of me. When someone does that I usually say "YOUR so gay...and that makes me feel bad." Everyone knows I'm gay, so this usually upsets and confuses people, which is great if they say stupid shit like "that's so gay" every five minutes.

I'm way more annoyed by fag I guess. In person I do usually brush it off or say something equally stupid like "yes I am and no you can't suck my dick."
But it's my answering machine that drives me insane. It never fails that I have at least one message from someone (usually a straight male friend, usually the ones who have recently been in the armed forces) yelling "answer the phone you fag!" I dunno why guys think this is the way to get me to pick up. Guys like this say it so much it's second nature, and calling them out when they do it in person usually does me no good. They either get really embarassed and apoligize a lot, which is ackward and a stronger reaction than I had to the word in the first place. Or then they start going "oh sorry I don't mean you Jay" everytime they say it. Oh awesome, I'm the special excluded fag. Everyone else who is a fag sucks except me. Straight guys can be so fucking boring.

[slaxxx]

This is nothing personal at all basschick, but for someone who acts like she's so tolerant and progressive-thinking, you sure have a lot of animosity towards straight men. Are you not married to one?

jim - slut is a weapon against a woman because str8 men consider a sexually active women a low low person

Oh and women don't do this? Please, women gossip all the time about who is dressed like a whore, who is slutty, etc. etc. No straight man looks down on a sexually active woman, though if by "sexually active" you meant a girl who sleeps with everyone or a prostitute....you know, a slut....then yeah, sure it's a common thing. But plenty of women and gay men look down on dangerously excessive sexual promiscuity too.

ever notice how str8 men make anything sexual an insult? cock sucker, fucker, you fuck. funny - 'cause most people LIKE having sex, so why are sexual comments insults?

I guess you have never said "fuck you" before? Everyone says stuff like that, except really uptight assholes, and uptight assholes can be straight, gay, bi, or tranny. It's just an insult, "fucker" or "you fuck" does not offend anyone...there's nothing to read into it unless you are trying to find something to be offended by.

they also make any type of person they perceive takes a cock in any orifice an insult - gay men, prostitutes, sexually active women...

Not all do, I don't. You are talking about a stereotype, yet you're using the word "ALL," which makes it seem like you have more of a problem with straight men than you do with gays being treated unfairly. Notice I said the word "seem."

maybe str8 men ALL need sexual acceptance therapy

Maybe you saying that as joke is the same thing as a "str8" man saying "that's so gay" as a joke. Maybe it was not meant with malice but ended up offending them anyway. Oh and btw...it's not just straight men...I've heard straight women say plenty of nasty things about gays, and I've heard them use "omg that's so gay" or "eh, it's kinda gay LOL"...even on webmaster boards, and referring to people, not Malibu Ken or Madonna records (which I personally don't consider gay in any sense of the word)

Getting back on topic...no one, straight or gay, who is sensitive to another person's feelings uses the word "gay" to mean something bad. I admit I did that as a little kid but.....I was a little kid....no one corrected me if I knocked over my legos and went "damn it...these legos are so gay" But as an adult, I don't do that.

I have gay friends both online and off, my suitemate in college was very openly gay....so I'm not just pulling all this out of my ass (no pun intended heheh). So you can't say that it's an issue with straight men, because 1) straight women do it too and 2) it's only an issue with people who say stuff like that, not an entire sexuality...and if we're defined by our sexuality, criticizing straight men while being gay is the same thing as straight men criticizing gays. Is a black person hating whites better than a white person hating blacks....or does hate like that affect all of us and it doesn't matter who does it to who?

A truly tolerant and progressive person does not have a problem with any sexual orientation, but rather the people who use sexuality to insult others. And while the majority of the responses in this thread indicate real tolerance, some didn't...

[SLS]

I just heard "Hey faggot" comming from Will on Will & Grace and it reminded me of this thread. It was a joke about the guy on My Two Dads, answering the question what would the title of his next show be. What do guys think about that?

[basschick]

slaxxx - thanks for being a jerk, but actually i'm in a very happy ltr, and half my relationships have been with women.

read the news. did you know the NUMBER 1 cause of pregnant women's deaths under the age of 34 is that they are killed by their significant others? my daughter's last 3 bosses were all fired for sexual harrassment, and although she had no really bad problems with those men, several others women were really troubled by them.

look at str8 porn, bucko. half or more is aimed at hating women - as a sales technique. and god knows that all str8 men are loving and tolerant of their gay brothers, right? i've seen a couple "fag bashings" happen, and was almost caught in one with a friend - 5 guys with baseball bats yelling "Faggot" at us and believe me, we were lucky we got to the car and i peeled out of there.

there are some wonderful str8 men out there who i consider my best friends. but - according to the fbi and other sources like NOW - str8 men are by far the largest perps of violent crime.

and humiliation is a big tool. i don't think we should let people humiliate or shame us with words. and we certainly shouldn't help those who want to use things about us to mean something negative!

[CorbinFisher_BD]

In all fairness, Patti, I think you put too much weight on the "straight men" part and ignore other circumstances. I mean you come across as hating straight men.

I mean... violent crime is a leading cause of death for all demographics under the age of 34. Not just pregnant women. Young people under 34 seldom die of natural causes. Homicides... accidents... those are what kill young people. And so already, homicide would be a likely candidate for a leading cause of death for women under 34, and thus likewise pregnant women under 34. And homicide between spouses/partners is not unheard of. So "murder by SO of pregnant women under 34" has a lot of factors that go in to that being a likely end result of the statistics.

Then factor in the fact that gay men are not getting their gay male partners pregnant.

And lesbian women are not impregnating their lesbian female partners.

A lot of people have studied the phenomenon of husbands killing their pregnant wives - buckling under the pressure of added responsibilities, panicking and afraid of what being a father of a child or husband of a mother entails. Financial responsibilities. Emotional responsibilities. Susan Smith. Waneta Hoyt. What other infanticide by mother. Not cuz heterosexual women are fucked up or prone to violence, but because goodness knows what switch tripped in their head with all that they were going through and thinking and dealing with and unable to handle when it came to motherhood and its pressures.

In fact, did you know that in the United States, if you're an infant and murdered in your first week of life, there's a 90% chance the person that murdered you was a woman - most likely your mother?

Does that mean that new mothers are bad people? That heterosexual women have some sort of problem? Because I'm willing to bet that the vast majority of those women who are the perpretrators in 90% of all week-old infant homicides are heterosexual women.

Of course it doesn't mean that. It's just that circumstances lend themselves to a mother being the most likely perpetrator when a child is murdered in the first week of infancy. And there's a societal and likely biological and psychological factor at play here when some young parents are unable to handle the pressures of parenthood or impending parenthood.

I think you're being unfair towards straight men, and putting too much value on the "straight man" aspect of the person in the statistics you point out. As if they reason they commit the crime is they're straight. Or that if they weren't straight, nothing bad woulda happen and everything woulda been ok. It was just that they were a goddamn straight man that they had to go and do that shit.

when in actuality, it's just a correlation factor, not a causation factor. Like me saying "Did you know that white people cause the majority of car accidents Vermont?!?!" Well... of course they do!

[basschick]

you don't think it's amazing that pregnant women aren't killed by accidents or pregnancy-related health problems before murder by lovers?

i sure do! accidents - especially car accidents - are plentiful. i would have expected it to be that.

[CorbinFisher_BD]

you don't think it's amazing that pregnant women aren't killed by accidents or pregnancy-related health problems before murder by lovers?

i sure do! accidents - especially car accidents - are plentiful. i would have expected it to be that.

Of course it's a fucked up fact that so many pregnant women are killed by their partners. That's a sad mark on society and humanity and whatever psychological factors go in to such horrible actions being committed.

But again, homicides are already a leading cause of death among young people. And I don't know about all pregnant women, but thinking of the ones I've known, they probably engage in lifestyle changes that'd make a dent in the likelihood of accidental death. A pregnant woman might drive more carefully. Not go bike riding or take extra care in descending a flight of steps. Not go skiing. Get medical checkups more frequently and be immersed in the healthcare system. So all of those factors could contribute to decreases in accidental causes of death among pregnant women.

I'm not disputing that there's an alarming phenomenon of pregant women being killed by their partners. I'm just saying that there's more to statistics than just the statistics, and that being a heterosexual male in and of itself doesn't make anyone a bad person, nor does it make them more prone and more likely to becoming a bad person.