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I was recently talking about this with Bec. She suggested this would be the perfect place to get an answer.
What percentage of your sales are coming from surfers that either consider themselves straight or are hiding their sexuality.
I would think the internet gives these individuals a perfect opportunity to explore their sexuality in anonymity. As a result they would be more likely to purchse.
Do any of you market towards this market?
The closeted individual is pretty difficult to figure out in terms of behaviour.
Here are a couple of non-porn site examples that, I think, illustrate that it's probably pretty hard to market to these guys in a significant way.
I used to work in a video store (main stream Hollywood movies and porn). This Portuguese, straight, Catholic man in his 40s had a membership there for his family. He opened a separate membership so he could rent porn. A few days later, he'd come in (fresh from confession, I'm guessing) and have me cancel the membership card.
A couple of weeks later, he'd be back. And we'd repeat the whole thing. When he'd ask me to cancel the card, I'd explain that we'd have to go through the whole application, membership fee thing all over again if he wanted to open it. Nope, he wouldn't be opening another one. A couple of weeks later, he'd be back again.
Another customer would come in about once a month, buy four or five gay DVDs. A week or so later, I was shelving movies and I saw a bag of DVDs stuffed under one of the racks. This happened about three or four times before I figured out what was going on. I'm assuming he'd buy the movies, watch them, and returned them to us because he didn't want anyone finding them in his home, but he just didn't want to throw them away.
Another friend of mine cruises the chat rooms. He says he does better cruising as a "bi" male.
How do you market for this kind of behaviour?
I sure don't worry about it on my sites, but then, with my bear site there's nothing even close to straight there. If you're into my site with all of the bears, leather, he-men, barebacking galleries, then you're not just exploring your gay side.
I have read on one of the other boards that someone like uses AVS's like SexKey or CyberAge because they found "straight" traffic was more willing to buy those programs because they looked straight (in case anyone discovered the site in your Internet cache or saw the charge on your credit card) but they had enough gay sites that could satisfy their need to explore.
Good luck
Dzinerbear
The main reason I'm looking into this is that I have a hard time understanding the motivations in the gay market. I can look at most straght niches and even though they might not appeal to me I can understand why someone might find it appealing.
I'm thinking I might be better able to target this demographic more effectively than the more mainstream gay market.
Does this make any sense?
Does it make any sense? Sort of, but not really.
If you can understand a "big tits" site, or "guys cumming on girls tits" site, then why can't you understand "gay guys seducing drunk straight guys," or "barebacking czech boys," or "peeping toms in the frat house?" It's all pretty much the same, just the players and genders are changed.
I think trying to market to closeted straight men is much more difficult. In some regards, I think they might not have the experience to know what they're into. Am I wrong or off-base?
I don't know, if you haven't had much gay sex, how would you know what you liked? You've probably got to be fucked with a dildo before you figure out you like it.
I did a search in Overture for straight gay man, and the numbers aren't that high:
453 gay man straight
293 straight man gay sex
154 gay man plan straight
123 gay into man sex straight tricked
108 straight man having gay sex
103 gay man straight woman
98 gay gone man straight
93 gay man man straight
87 college gay man straight
82 gay go man straight
63 straight man fucking gay man
58 gay man straight turn
55 gay man straight turned
49 gay man straight turning
45 gay man porn straight
39 gay in man porn straight
These numbers represent the number of people who were looking for those terms last month in some of the bigger search engines. Maybe these numbers mean nothing, maybe they mean that "straight men" looking for gay porn aren't using the word "straight" in their searches.
I just think with closeted guys, you have so many phobias, misconceptions, and hang-ups to get over, I just wouldn't know where to begin marketing to them. If you launch a site, in all likelihood you'll sell to gay guys fantasizing about getting a straight guy's cock in his mouth.
Cheers
Dzinerbear
I think where Gel is coming from here Michael is he is helping me with tgp submissions, and I have gay galleries, and he's clueless right now on the best places and methods/categories for them. We're testing out how they do on "straight" tgps that have gay categories and also submitting them to gay tgps. I think he's wanting to figure out if the traffic off of a "straight" tgp is actually straight men looking at the gay niche, or is it actually gay men clicking thru... or even women looking for solo stud sites --if that makes sense? If we list on straight tgps -- who are we actually having click thru.
Umm? It's like, for the webmasters, give 'em what they want. It's like, for the surfer/searcher, find what turns me on, get off, close browser. Sure seems to me to be sameo-sameo as for straight porn.Quote:
Originally posted by gel
. . . I have a hard time understanding the motivations in the gay market.
Dzinerbear said it -- I'll repeat. If you can understand the motivation behind a straight 'college coeds' bare all' you shouldn't have a problem understanding a gay 'college boys bare all' site. One turns on a straight guy maybe searching to relive his college days or having fantasies about younger meat -- ditto the other, except the guy. There are some unique niches in both camps, but far more that are almost identical.
Woops -- thanks LdyLnWolf1 -- that puts a different spin on it.
"I think he's wanting to figure out if the traffic off of a "straight" tgp is actually straight men looking at the gay niche, or is it actually gay men clicking thru... or even women looking for solo stud sites --if that makes sense? If we list on straight tgps -- who are we actually having click thru." -- LdyLnWolf1
A straight tgp with a strong gay presence will have all three types traffic. A stright tgp with a weak gay presence will usually only bring you straight curious guys and stud seeking women.
My guess is you'll never know what traffic you're receiving unless you have ways to filter it to a hard core gay site, a hot stud for women site, vs a bi curious (or similar) site. Even then you'll be guessing to some degree; for example what about the lesbian traffic that may go to any of the three (depending upon her degree of comfort).
If what you're offering at a stright tgp within their gay category (assuming no sub-categories for becoming more specific) is just generic 'gay' you may get mostly the stright curious dudes, 'cause gay guys and those hot stud seaking women want exactlty what they want -- usually no generic.
Offer hot solo studs and you may get all three -- 'cause that appeals to some gay guys, women looking for hot studs and some curious, but afraid to look at gay sex, straight(?) guys.
Summary, tpg traffic is usually surfers that wants what you said you were selling in the gallery you posted.
Gotcha now, Bec. Why the hell did you send a man to get directions? You know we just always fuck it up. :goof:
Very kidding
Dzinerbear
If it wasn't for the internet, I'd probably still be straight!
As a "straight" man I surfed TheHun and bought an AdultCheck membership ('96-'98). My gaze always lingered too long on the schlongs, but as long as I was on a straight site... everything in my mind was still cool... I wasn't no fag, I didn't wear dresses, my wrists weren't limp and I didn't talk with a lisp!
Ocassionally, I would peek in on the gay galleries and sites and usually what I found wasn't for me (smooth young guys). I would sit up and take notice (and my little friend too) when the men were of the masculine variety... I liked them hairy butch guys! I never had realized that gay men came in so many flavors.
Eventually, I quit looking at the straight sites and started surfing the gay sites exclusively and bought myself a UGAS membership. Then there was no denying... I was gay!
IMO, there are millions of closeted surfers on the internet, just like I used to be. When I first started meeting other men in chat and in-person (yeah, I was kinda slutty for 2 1/2 years... had to make up for lost time), I was amazed that many of them had stories similar to mine! Married men, divorced men, men with kids... you name it, their homosexual tendencies awakended by gay/straight chat rooms and internet porn.
In conclusion, the best way to market to closeted surfers is with sites with both straight and gay content... and as far as I know, that would be mixed AVS systems like CyberAge, ProAdult, DeluxePass, etc.
my personal experience is that almost all my sales come from gay traffic sources or searches. i know people who make gay "curiosity" sales from straight traffic, but i'm not one of them.
i do good sales off gay tgps, and very few gay sales off straight, but once again, that's just my experience. the best sales i ever did from a male gallery posted at a straight tgp was a gallery that featured two straight guys jacking off together. 5 sales on that one gallery, but that is the exception for me.
Quote:
Originally posted by Dzinerbear
Gotcha now, Bec. Why the hell did you send a man to get directions? You know we just always fuck it up. :goof:
Very kidding
Dzinerbear
LOL
Actually this question is both for what me and bec are working on and for research for my own projects.
Thanks for the input.