Model recruiting at Internext

I'd like to seek the opinions of some of the folks here.

Perhaps I'm living in a fantasy world, but personally I consider it extremely tacky for a producer or photographer who runs a site competitive to ours to go up to one of our models who is VERY CLEARLY working for us, and brought to Internext at our expense (wearing our clothing, handing out cards and information for us, etc.) and ask him to model. Did I not get the memo, or are there just a bunch of clueless people?

While we do talk to models at Internext, the first question (if they aren't obviously working for a site or studio) is usually "Who brought you here" or "who are you representing" and only if there is no affiliation -- even if the model isn't exclusive -- would we then pursue the possibility of having a model work for us.

Yet each of our models had at least a handful of guys come up to them (some from some fairly big players) and encourage them to model, sometimes subtlely, sometimes very aggressively.

Fortunately, we have a great relationship with all of our models, so they immediately told said phoographers to talk to us (none did, interestingly) but I still consider it rather unprofessional. Am I living in fantasyland?

Also, what about someone in the industry who goes to EVERY SINGLE MODEL of ours and asks them if they escort? Again, perhaps this is something that's standard in the industry, but of our 150+ models, I think we have one or two who do, and we generally don't bring those guys to Internext because we don't want to portray that image. It would seem that if you were interested in finding an escort, again you could perhaps be a little more subtle about it. In this case, our models weren't terribly offended, but it was a little unnerving for a couple of them.

Am I crazy?

Hey Chip,

Sorry I missed you in Vegas. I guess we will have to meet next time.

I haven't had models before but thought I would give my input. I don't think you are crazy. I would agree with you and think it is tacky for people to try to recruit your models but I guess I would expect it. I have seen this happen quite a bit but if I had models I wouldn't be very happy about it either. I am sure Abercrombie & Fitch models from Bel Ami models have this happen to them all the time. I guess there isn't much you can do about it. As long as your models are happy which it definetly sounds like they are I wouldn't worry about it. I think it would also be good if your models know what to do if approached with that situation.

Mark

chip this is precisely why i stopped bringing models to shows... its extremely rude for "big players" to bad mouth a model's employer and suggest that they'd do better working for someone else. and it happens all the time.

btw hit me up sometime, havent chatted since florida.

icq 1148977
dawgy[@]woofmedia.com

Soliciting someone else's models is tacky, but you seem to have your models trained properly to refer such requests to you. A company does not bring models to a convention so that the _model_ gets more business, the company brings them to promote the _company_ and for the _company _ to get more business.
However, to believe that all the other players in the business--good, bad, big, small, fly-by-night or otherwise--will play ethically is a fantasy. You can do the right thing by preparing your models and staff for such solicitations and instructing them as to how you want them to respond. If someone really is interested in shooting one of your models, they should come through the owner, not directly to the model. Of course there will always be the guy that thinks all models are for rent and he is just looking to cop a cheap feel--and your models should be prepared for that too. If they know those questions are coming then they can be prepared to answer them in a dignified way.
If an offer does come along that would be a big break for your model, let him know you want him to be successful. If a legitimate rep from a big studio is enamored with your model and wants to offer a huge contract that is 10 times what you can pay to a guy that models for you just part-time, great! If some guy who just bought a used camera off EBay wants your model to appear in his next inter-species film that can't be marketed in civilized nations then you want your model to know he can count on you to fend off those leeches.
Prepare your models for all the questions that may be asked of them. Let them know that you are there to protect them from the occasional shyster but if there really is a can't-pass-up-opportunity you will work with them to make sure they are treated fairly. This is a small industry, so if you conduct yourself and your affairs with dignity you will be treated with dignity. If you try to use shortcuts, steal talent, circumvent owners, or screw someone out of what is rightfully theirs then you risk alienating yourself and being pushed out.
Do the right thing--act like your mother knows every step you make.
[if that doesn't work, act like MY mother knows every step you make]
;-)

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Originally posted by Dawgy
chip this is precisely why i stopped bringing models to shows... its extremely rude for "big players" to bad mouth a model's employer and suggest that they'd do better working for someone else. and it happens all the time.

btw hit me up sometime, havent chatted since florida.

icq 1148977
dawgy[@]woofmedia.com

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You know I had this happen here in Australia last year with a Sydney based porn site that also does leased feeds.

The guy begged me for models so I tested him with my most trusted hottie. The guy got there .. was given cards from the Sydney company, I was bad talked, etc. etc. Of course my model told me immediately. Later I heard at the last Internext that he invited a bunch of big players to dinner.. they ate.. and he got a phone call as the meal was ending and left the table.. leaving all he invited to pay ha ha

The good thing about guys like these is you know who NOT to do business with. Guys like this will wear themselves out very quickly with everyone.

Chip I'm glad you brought this up... but some names would be nice so we know who to avoid. If you want to send me a list privately I'd greatly appreciate it.

I'll be at Vegas next year.. look forward to seeing some new faces there!

I don't like it either. It's unethical. It's unprofessional. And it's bad-business. We invest significant resources into recruiting and retaining fresh talent. And, like Chip, I'd be pissed as hell to watch some lazy-ass who can't find his own models try to hijack mine right in front of me. It happened to us last year, both in Las Vegas and Hollywood FL. In fact, last year we had to pull the plug on most Model Fanmail on our flagship website because it was being abused by people within the industry to solicit talent for modeling and other naughty things. Our industry, I believe, is prone to a high number of sleazebags, Not as many as politics, but a high number anyway. Chip, you did the right thing by briefing your guys in advance about the dangers.

Steve

PS TO ALL: Sorry we didn't make it to Las Vegas this year. We hope to see our friends (including the ones we haven't met yet) in '05 and then back in Vegas next year.

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Originally posted by citiboyz

PS TO ALL: Sorry we didn't make it to Las Vegas this year. We hope to see our friends (including the ones we haven't met yet) in '05 and then back in Vegas next year. [/B]

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I was wondering where you were at this year. Hope to see you next year. Have a good year.

Mark

Thanks, Mark. Here's wishing a great '05 to you, too!

::raising my glass::

Steve

Nice seeing you face here, Steven....looking forward to doing in person soon!

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Originally posted by Squirt

The good thing about guys like these is you know who NOT to do business with. Guys like this will wear themselves out very quickly with everyone.

Chip I'm glad you brought this up... but some names would be nice so we know who to avoid. If you want to send me a list privately I'd greatly appreciate it.

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Well, there are others, but one particularly egregious offender is a guy from, I think, Tropics Video (waiting on a URL.)

Not only did the guy track down and contact one of our models BEFORE the show, but even after said model told him to discuss anything with us (which never happened), this guy has pestered him with followup emails offering various deals to do work with him. Definitely not a way to win friends and influence people in this industry, but I guess some people either don't get it or don't care.

It's definitely a bummer when people do stuff like that.

You did the right thing though, Chip, in making sure you brought models you had good heads on their shoulders, knew why they were in town, knew how to answer offers and approaches and are loyal to your company.

No disrespect meant to the models by insuinuating they're property or anything like that, but attempting to steal away one company's models when they're obviously there on behalf of that company is like stealing someone's banners and putting up your own. Or spraypainting them with your logos. Handing out someone else's flyers and business cards with their name inked out and yours written in. It's crap.

I remember last year hanging out with Johan Paulik at the Cybersocket Web Awards when another webmaster with some company I'm not familiar with kept trying to pick up on him. Non stop. Trying to get him to go back to his room. Offering him money. Not leaving him alone. I at first attributed it to his being wasted but ultimately settled on him just being a sloppy and tactless eejit. Finally I had to step in to get the guy to go the hell away because Johan was too polite and kind to do it himself and didn't have the English language down well enough to tell the guy off like he deserved to be told off.

Same again this last year with a CorbinFisher model. This model was straight and another webmaster not only aggressively tried to pick up on him but had the nerve to get all offended, uppity and insulting when the model said he was straight. The model wasn't just hanging out, either. He also works for the company, was there actively promoting his company. The extent to which this webmaster's behavior was inappropriate left me sittin there shakin my head.

Unfortunately, there will always be skeezy types out there. So the best way to defend against it is not to hope it won't happen and they won't be around. It's to let your models know why they're in town, what they're doin' there, who they represent, and how to respond to such situations. Bring some intelligent, loyal and levelheaded models and prep em for the inevitable and you'll get through.

Does the fact that "it happens" mean it's ok and no big deal. Naw. It's still crappy. But at least you're aware enough of it to prep for it next time around.

BTW... this doesn't have anything to do with my getting up on the coffee table in the middle of the QFest party and screaming out at the top of my lungs "THE BOYFUNK BOYS NEED TO RUN A TRAIN ON MY ASS!", does it?

I had a moment of weakness, and for that I apologize.

Hmmmm. I must have been in one of the adjoining rooms at the moment that happened.... :)

That is low and unprofessional, saw guys doing it all over. The best thing is to know your models and establish a good relationship with them. I guess we will have people of all kinds in this industry.

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Originally posted by BDBionic

I remember last year hanging out with Johan Paulik at the Cybersocket Web Awards when another webmaster with some company I'm not familiar with kept trying to pick up on him. Non stop. Trying to get him to go back to his room. Offering him money. Not leaving him alone.

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And I promise not to do that again :)

That is unless Just John is around. Then I can't be held accountable for either of our actions. So, I apologize ahead of time :-)