Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
Um, well, Squirt, if you look back through all the posts here, nobody ever used the word bear once. We just said he had a little fur on him. BIG difference.
Printable View
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
Um, well, Squirt, if you look back through all the posts here, nobody ever used the word bear once. We just said he had a little fur on him. BIG difference.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude
fur, bear, woof it's all new to me... taking notes. Bears have fur but guys with fur aren't necessarily bears and both can get a woof
As well as Chubby or muscular, smooth but with face hair and anything else that the bear label-ist finds to be in his own definition of bear.
When I first knew the term, from my grandmother in the 70's, she was talking about Russian men that looked a lot like Zangief from Street Fighter.
http://digitalninja.mk5.org/zangief.jpg
She would say, "Like Big Russian Bear" and I think she was quoting Rocky and His Friends (1959) aka: "Rocky & Bullwinkle & Friends"
But I know I'll get blasted with a string of "No! Bear was invented in the 80's by some guy who printed it with an image of a beer belly, leather queen sewing drapes and smoking a cigar."
Squirt ... maybe this will help.
When thinking about bears think: hairy bodies, facial hair, and huskier bodies.
Now, a guy doesn't have to have all three qualities to be considered a bear, but he needs more of them than not.
For instance, someone like Burt Reynolds circa 1970s would be considered by some as a bear or bearish. He's not huskier, but he's hairy and had a moustache.
I guy like Grizzily Adams, again circa 1970s television, had all three qualities. Tom Sellect would be considered by many as a bear or bearish.
Stone Cold Steve Austin is definitely a bear, but he's smooth. But he's got big muscles, a bald head, and a goatee - three big "daddy" features.
Danny Devito's a bear, so's Al from Tool Time. Robin Williams is hairy like a bear, but he's got no facial hair and he's really girly. Mr. French from A Family Affair wasn't exactly over-the-top butch, but he's a bear.
Bears almost always have to have some years under their belt to be considered a bear. But it's not impossible to find bears in their 20s. If a bear is youngish and on the cute side, then we'd probably call him a cub.
The lines between bears, cubs, and daddies aren't always very clear, but keep practicing and you'll get it right.
BTW Squirt, did you figure out how much you want to shoot your "bear?" Jim and I are still interested.
Michael
These aren't MY definitions, but the defintions that come FROM the bear community itself. Again, hang out with the bears, guy, and you'll quickly learn to pinpoint what a proper bear is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Happysucks
Well, like I've said, most webmasters toss hairy guys up on their sites all the time and call them bears. So hey, you can do it if you're looking to sell a niche. But big muscular bodybuilders have never been regarded as bears to my knowledge.Quote:
But I know I'll get blasted with a string of "No! Bear was invented in the 80's by some guy who printed it with an image of a beer belly, leather queen sewing drapes and smoking a cigar."
For the record:
Predominant Definitions within the Bear Community:
Bear: Typically an overweight, stocky or chubby guy with or without fur, usally of an older age. Muscle men are usually not called "bears." They're simply body builders.
Cub: Same as above, but usually younger. Or he takes the submissive role in bed.
Muscle bear: A hairy muscular guy, usually of a larger size. (With muscle guys, a furry chest is usually their entry way into bear domain. Without it, they would just be body builders. Muscle bears and cubs are usally the one instance where fur is what gets you the "bear" or "cub" label.)
Otter: A thin hairy guy.
Pup: A younger guy who prefers to hang out in the bear and leather communities, usually smooth, but can also be hairy--though they are usually called otters.
This is right from the bear manual. :)
As a member of Saw Mill Camp Ground, Friends with The Florida Growlers, and the Florida Rain Makers... I think have a good understanding but its ok if you want to keep assuming I'm some kid with a thumb up his ass.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude
Don't worry buddy! He's not a bear either... he's just hot! And so was your model.Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
Somehow this has turned into a 'define a bear' thread. So let me throw my $.02 in to the fray.
I use the term 'bear' all of the time when making AVS sites even when the guy might not fit the most common definitions. Maybe the guy is too young, not hairy enough or heavy enough (btw, most bear paysites don't include heavy bears at all). But the term 'bear' is a searched for 100 times more often than 'cub', 'hairy' or 'daddy' (my personal favorite). So if your site is SEO for bear key phrases, the more likely searchers will find your site. Will the searcher be disappointed when he finds that the bear is really a cub? Probably not. Chances are, he was just looking for guys that are not twinks.
Believe it or not, most men looking for porn aren't overly concerned about the use of exact definitions. Sure, some guys might get pissed when you tell them it's a bear when it's really an otter... but fuck 'em! Seriously! Get a life! A while back I got some grief over a bear site review of mine. I had Will West on the tour and most people agreed that he wasn't a bear. I do also agree, he is more of the 'hairy daddy' type. But if I can't use Will West on bear site, I don't want to live in this world! Lol
On the other hand, don't try to pass off over-the-hill twinks as bears either! Some sites, usually the really big sponsors, are absolutely laughable when it comes to bears. One of my pet peeves is a leased feed called "Bears and Cubs". They have a blonde twink standing next to thin, lightly hairy latino looking guy. Currently they have movie clips from a video called "Hot Twink Studs" playing on their feeds. I don't think this is going to satisfy anyone!
Here is a pic from the feed for illustration purposes...
nice work, what is the pricing like on this content?
cheers,
Luke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
I would definitely agree with all of this. And I certainly understand why people put men into certain categories (i.e., bear, daddy) to sell memberships even if they don't really fit those labels, and I understand that many webmasters are very lenient in their definitions (and, indeed, that a lot of surfers don't really care), but let's just be honest about it and admit that that is what we are doing.
And I wasn't really making a big deal out of anything, just saying, "Sorry, happy, but that Asian muscle guy is not a bear under any definition that I know of." That's all. I didn't expect to get raked over the coals for it. I mean, geez, I wasn't saying, "How dare you call this guy a bear, you little ignorant nitwit? What are you thinking?" Sheesh. It's all in good fun. :)
That said, I am a little weary of alleged "bear" and "leather" sites these days and their increasingly watered down depictions of those communities. You can't just put a guy in leather chaps and say, "Hey, it's a leather video." It doesn't work like that. There is a whole moral code and a whole specific set of ethics to participating in leather culture, and I just think it's a little sad to see these things get bastardized for mass consumption.
It's like, would you include someone like Arnold Scwarzenegger on your site and call him a bear just because he's a "big guy"? There is a whole history and a culture and community to these movements, and it just seems like as younger generations keep coming up, those histories are being rewritten to placate the masses. It's like when they remade "Anastasia" for children and decided to change it so that the royal family was killed on a train crash instead of being shot to death in the dirty basement of a prison.
Again, I certainly understand the need to "open things up" in order to appeal to broader audiences, but I think when you're part of a certain movement, you feel it has a very special place in your heart, and you don't want to see it get misrepresented for financial profit. As somewhat of a cub myself, I don't want to see my community be misrepresented. To a lot of us, authenticity is important to maintaining a true community.
Now, all of that said, the reality is that I understand this business, and like I said, I totally understand why some webmasters do what they do, and I'm OK with it. In the end, these things really aren't all that important in the adult porn world. So hey, if a webmaster wants to call a big huge burly Asian muscle guy a bear, you go for it. No judgment. I'm still gonna point out that you're 'wrong,' but I'll do it with a wink and a nudge and with no hard feelings. We're all here to make money and make a living, so all the power to you if you find ways of doing it. :)
Well, that's not what I was saying, lil' guy. Sorry if I gave you that impression.Quote:
Originally Posted by Happysucks
It's all good. ;)
Does he do any of the photos for that men in suits site?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzinerbear
Just added him to my webmaster's section at gay bum links.
Hope it helps. :)
No, I don't believe Jon shoots for Menatplay.com. But the style is similar (meant as a compliment to both parties), don't you think?Quote:
Originally Posted by robin
And thanks for linking jonnofilms.com Robin. :)
This dude is TOTALLY a muscle bear!Quote:
Originally Posted by Happysucks
Ken, check out Tagame for some nasty japanese leather/bear art!