basschick, i couldn't agree more - that's why the texas oil boys keep winning - we are too weak as minorities.
'the humanity party'
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basschick, i couldn't agree more - that's why the texas oil boys keep winning - we are too weak as minorities.
'the humanity party'
Why? Saying the country's fucked in the sense things will happen in the next four years constituting this country getting fucked isn't the same thing as saying everyone who disagrees with you is a fuck.Quote:
Originally posted by cj.
[B]Bionic, your last post was intolerant & offensive to those of us who aren't gay, but who aren't fuckheads either ...
This country was presented with the issue of homosexuality and responded with a resounding "Go away." To think that people's votes against gay marriage were driven more by their judgements towards marriage than by their judgements of homosexuals, I believe, is unrealistically optimistic. Homosexuality became an issue in this election for the first time ever, and the response was for right wing forces to mobilize to such a profound extent as champions of their moral perspective and impose it all upon the entire nation.Quote:
Originally posted by cj. How can you expect to be listened to when you say things like 'If you're gay, you're not welcome here' when *almost half* of the population were AGAINST bush and his principals (and lets not forget all of those who didn't vote). Ok, so 70 - 75% of people voted against gay marriage - how does that show that 75% of the population of the USA is against gay people?!?!
That progressives and liberals were either too complacent or apathetic to oppose that is just proof all the more that the entire world - not just the US - is now being led by the extreme right wing elements of a single political party. That's the reality here.
That Bush managed to get a majority at all is astounding and his successed should breed any faith in the system or hope for the future.
Again, we're using different definitions of "fucked" here. Though its versatility is one of the great things about the word, it also lends itself to confusion and misinterpretation at time.Quote:
Originally posted by cj. Tolerance works both ways - you can't expect to be listened to if you don't listen to your opposition & address their points without resorting to 'you are all fucked'.
Regardless, I've spent plenty of time listening to my newfound opposition and addressing their points for a good long time. The 10 years I spent as an active and participating member of the Republican party made it quite apparent how that party works and who controls it.
The far right. "Extremists" would be the only thing worth calling them. They dictate any and everything that comes out of that party, yanking any and all candidates to the right with the very first primary vote and ensuring they stay right there all throughout.
Rove/Bush/Cheney realized that early on, knowing full well the best way to win themselves a second term was mobilize that motivated base eager to ensure God's candidate occupied the White House and their moral ideology had a champion in the Oval Office. And that's exactly what they succeeded in doing - getting out their core who are the most driven and organized voting elements in American society today.
Personally - I believe the gay community went too far too fast. It wasn't too long that we just won the right to fuck in Texas and other states. We needed more Will & Graces, Civil Unions, Gay Coaches & Teachers, and work on Don't ask Don't tell. People need time to digest things. When you're too in your face - yesterday proved what will happen.
However, I am very saddened by the 70% turn out against Gay Marriage. What is really disheartening to me is that for such a high number - more then then just a handful of democrats including women and minorities voted against us. The gay community has always been very loyal to women in regards to abortion and equal pay. We have also been very loyal to minorities in regards to civil rights and affirmative action. So... you'll have to excuse me for feeling very bitter and jaded right now. The knife in my back cut deeply.
I agree 100% with Brian that the Dems need to stop courting voters who do not want them. I think it's sickening that Ted Kennedy can say he's proud to be a Liberal - but John Kerry couldn't/wouldn't. Democrats have allowed Republicans to demonize the word Liberal for almost 20 years. Where the fuck is my Liberal Pride Parade!
without melding these various people together - and according the the exit polls, more women voted than men - they vote according to their worst fears. but give them a feeling of commonality and purpose, and they will vote with that.
human beings are very gregarious. they have a tendancy to join groups - for example, i have found that a lot of conservative housewives are simply lonely. the more they feel unfulfilled, the more they'll vote partly for a feeling of belonging to a community. get to very gently know these people, and they will feel one with you. when that happens - when you open their eyes to the facts of what you have in common, it's not just that you will win votes... you will help enlighten a fellow human being see you as a fellow human being.
Agreed.Quote:
Originally posted by djdez
Personally - I believe the gay community went too far too fast.
I have said that from the start, equality however, no matter who is wanting it always seems to be a one-sided argument, the majority of gay 'campaigners' for equality so fr as the gay marriage issue goes wanted just what was mentioned by CJ above, the same EXACT rights as a straight married couple wants which is by no means a bad thing but, at the same time, lets not compare apples to oranges, as we found out a couple of days ago, it can often backfire.
Regards,
Lee