How Much Damage Can A Cartoon Do?

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Originally Posted by dannyz

One more thing on this...just my opinions LOL but don't want to get into a big political debate with you. The thing that most bothers me about the current US administration is that they try to label anyone who does not agree with US policies as 'terrorists.'

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Hi dannyz:
Well I have read opponents of Bush say this many times, but as far as I can see, that is just a general feeling. Of course, everyone's impressions are their reality. But is it reality?

Senator John Sunnunu, Republican of New Hampshire just blocked the reauthorization of the Patriot Act in the Senate... I haven't seen him labeled a terrorist. There's plenty of dissenting views.... I can think of numerous conservative pundits - George Will and Bob Novack - who always opposed going to war in Iraq. They still do, and they are on ABC and CNN every week. They aren't lebeled "terrorists" ... I just don't understand why if you are dissenting, you have to feel like "they are coming after you"

Now, as far as the warrantless wiretapping goes, I do think the feds are skating on pretty thin ice. But, that's why we are having oversight hearings and a public debate - and in democracies like the United States the governments are held accountable one way or the other.

Steve

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Originally Posted by desslock

Hi dannyz:
Well I have read opponents of Bush say this many times, but as far as I can see, that is just a general feeling. Of course, everyone's impressions are their reality. But is it reality?

Senator John Sunnunu, Republican of New Hampshire just blocked the reauthorization of the Patriot Act in the Senate... I haven't seen him labeled a terrorist.

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I think he's more referring to statements the president makes to the people in speeches, not the russeling that politicians do, that's their job. When the average person hears the propaganda Bush pushes they feel intimidated, scared, alienated and unAmerican if they have differing views. Here are some examples I think Dannyz is referring to:

The doctrine that says either you're with us or you're with the enemy, it still stands. And there's a lot of good folks hunting these people down.
-- Oct. 24, 2002

We have a calling from beyond the stars to stand for freedom, and America will always be faithful to that cause.
-- Washington, D.C., Jan. 19, 2005

I see an opportunity at home when I hear the stories of Christian and Jewish women alike, helping women of cover, Arab American women go shop because they're afraid to leave their home.
-- State Department, Oct. 4, 2001

[The evildoers] are hearing from a tolerant nation, a nation that respects Islam and values our many Muslim citizens. They are hearing from a prayerful nation, a nation that prays to an almighty God for protection and for peace.
-- Sacramento, California, Oct. 17, 2001

You can't reason with these people. There's no need to negotiate with them. Therapy is not going to work.
-- June 18, 2004

Well, I think that the free world is -- must recognize that no one is safe, that if you embrace freedom you're not safe from terrorism.
-- Washington, D.C., Oct. 14, 2002

Those of us who love freedom must work together to do everything we can to disrupt, deny and bring to justice these people who have no soul, no conscience, people that hate freedom.
-- Washington, D.C., Oct. 14, 2002

They're nothing but a bunch of cold-blooded killers. You've just got to understand that about the nature of the enemy. They hate us because we love. They hate, we love freedom, is why they hate us, and we're not going to quit loving freedom.
-- Davenport, Iowa, Sep. 16, 2002

They act out of hatred. We don't seek revenge. We seek justice out of love.
-- Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Aug. 29, 2002

No, I know all the war rhetoric, but it's all aimed at achieving peace.
-- Madison Central High School, Madison, Mississippi, Aug. 7, 2002

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Originally Posted by Squirt

I think he's more referring to statements the president makes to the people in speeches, not the russeling that politicians do, that's their job. When the average person hears the propaganda Bush pushes they feel intimidated, scared, alienated and unAmerican if they have differing views. Here are some examples I think Dannyz is referring to:

The doctrine that says either you're with us or you're with the enemy, it still stands. And there's a lot of good folks hunting these people down.
-- Oct. 24, 2002

We have a calling from beyond the stars to stand for freedom, and America will always be faithful to that cause.
-- Washington, D.C., Jan. 19, 2005

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Well like I said, people's impressions are their reality. I don't see how that intimidates someone who opposes the Patriot Act. And it's a shame when people spend their currency on claims like that, as that leaves no currency towards political leaders who really have squelched dissent --- like Hugo Chavez in Venezuela. But hey ... people don't understand why I think the way I do....

To me: Bush is obviously talking about the terrorists as the "cold blooded killers", not people who opppose his foreign policy. For crying out loud, the conservative as nails Conservative Political Action Conference had their big "What Happens After Bush" meeting last week, and Bob Barr talked about the civil rights problems with the Patriot Act, and the keynote was George Will. I'm not sure why I've been supportive of the war on terrorism. Before I really was more of an isolationist.

Actually, one reason I think Bush has been able to act in the way he has is because there are no competing views of foreign policy. It's one thing to say that Bush is dumb, and making everything worse... but stopping there has been the downfall of his opponents. You may not like his message, but its a message, and you know where Bush stands. (opposite personality: B Clinton, who was everything to everybody)

I've always thought the reason Bush won all of his elections was because all his opponents did was stand up and say "that's bad. I'm against it." And I've noticed Hillary Clinton is already taking a different tack....

If rhetoric that makes you scared and intimidated, check out some of the utterings from Iran's President Mohammad Khatami on how they feel about Isreal and the United States. What does China say about Taiwan?

That should really grind your gears.

Steve

You read the Bush quotes I posted here.

Irans president is as fucked up as Bush, no more, no less. They both have God on their side and have no tolerance, even for their own people.

I'm leaning more towards isolationism these days. America has been on a kick of world domination through technology rights and cultural warfare, just as the Romans were, going to far is what destroyed Rome.. If we pull back now, focus on ourselves, clean house a bit, evolve a little, we have a chance at keeping a formidable position for some time to come. If we keep going like this we're heading the way of Russia or Germany. In many ways we're walking the same path they've walked. What do you think?