lol, I can't say Fox and News in the same sentence without getting the giggles.
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lol, I can't say Fox and News in the same sentence without getting the giggles.
Caliente is not alone in this. He was just silly enough to not be PC, instead choosing to be very candid about his desires in a semi-public forum. Most consumers watch porn to see people do things they will not or can not do for a variety of reasons. Whether it is a straight guy who can only enjoy male-sex when he watches videos or a gay guy who could never see himself getting gang-banged or double-penetrated but wants to experience it via someone else -- it is the fundamental service provided by our industry. Performers do their job to satify our fantasies.
My hat off to Caliente for being honest in his opinions in this forum.
Keith
We believe in personal responsibility. You control your own actions. In our productions we choose to use condoms for anal sex, but not oral sex. To some that’s not safe enough. But, that’s where we draw the line.
When you see someone killed in a "Hollywood" movie nobody really dies. When you see someone do cocaine or other drugs it’s (most likely) not really drugs. It’s total fantasy: contrived and false. However, it’s not the same with bareback sex is it? Those dangerous actions being filmed are actually dangerous, to a degree that we find unacceptable.
Just like constructions workers wear hard hats and doctors wear gloves, our models wear condoms when they ass fuck. It’s only reasonable and prudent.
The penalty: We don’t make as much money as “barebacking” companies. But, there IS more to life than money.
We don't judge the conduct of others. We control our own and those we employ.
The bottom line: We love our boys and want them to live long and heathly lives.
Very true. People watch porn for the same reason they watch a blockbuster movie at the theatre with friends on a Friday night, they want to go on an adventure, escape reality, and have a great experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruisemaster
It's strange to see some people in this thread so brainwashed to think people with HIV are all meth users, promiscuous, or chronically irresponsible. That leads other uninformed people to believe that anyone who gets HIV deserves it, and that's not true, their logic is flawed.
Viruses don't discriminate. The flu, TB, a cold, HIV. Cancer doesn't discriminate either. If someone has cancer do we blame them and label them? NO.
The reason HIV is prevalent in the Gay community and Heterosexual community in Africa is because of anal sex. The CDC has found that Catholic Africans strictly abide by the Popes no condoms rule, and prevent pregnancy, by having unprotected anal sex with their female partners.
Think of your discriminating views.. women in Africa don't do meth or are chronically irresponsible or stupid, yet they get HIV.
Please don't spread the religious rights agenda by saying Gay men get HIV because they deserve it and are irresponsible, it's simply not true. People struck with HIV/AIDS or any other multitude of other life threatening ailments, deserve nothing but our compassion and support period, anything else is destructive to them and our community. :francais:
a lot of people do things that they see in porn movies - sex positions and other things. and 18 year old performers from the midwest aren't the only naive people - there are plenty of 18 year old viewers out there.
most people i know watch hollywood productions and think they don't believe what they see. yet virtually everyone i know - damned close to everyone - actually develops opinions about the actors based on the parts they play. susan lucci used to get hissed on the street by men and women - because they believed she was as evil and mean as erica kane. i've heard interviews with a lot of actors who play "bad guys", and how many people come up to them and insult them or tell them off. as a culture, we DO believe - even when we don't.
besides, any company or director that requires or allows their performers to go bareback is risking their lives. and anyone who wants to pretend that an 18 year old from wisconsin who lived with his family till now REALLY believes he can get HIV is simply rationalizing so they won't feel guilty. most 18 year olds believe anything someone over 30 tells them - so tell them firmly that it's okay to go condom-free (when you know it may not be) and they will really let you make that decision as an adult and an authority...
I think you're applying the exception as the norm here.Quote:
Originally Posted by basschick
I used to work for the cable company and got calls from people who thought the TV was talking to them. Do I think all people think the TV is talking to them? No. Do I think there are people who believe the TV is talking to them? Yes. Do I think we should have a warning before every program that says the TV isn't talking to you? No.
There will always be people who will do things that affect them in a negative way, or who are unwell, society as a whole isn't responsible for their actions, those individuals are.
I have compassion for those less fortunate, but I'm not personally responsible for their actions and the choices they make.
DalimiliQuote:
Originally Posted by dalimili
Actually I watch FOX News quite often and have a rather laissez-faire attitude on this entire issue.
Now, I do not watch ABC News much. And on Sunday mornings I'm usually not awake to watch This Week with Live Acidophilus....plus that show has really gotten lame. Meet The Press is groovy.
Steve
Not sure which 18 year olds you hang out with, but it's been my experience that the "younger" generation is just as stubborn headed as the kids in the 60s who believed in "don't trust anyone over 30".Quote:
Originally Posted by basschick
There are "kids" who will listen and do what is suggested to them by older adults..but at the same time, the current younger generation seems to be very into doing their own thing..but then..I think that's what being 18 has always been about.
The bottom line for me in this thread is that I see a lot of things on tv or hear on the radio or see in person that are bad. Things I should not do. Sometimes that influences me, sometimes it does not. But when it comes to the "judgement day", that's when the only thing you can say is "It was MY decision, and my decision only to do what I did."
I don't believe drug use in the gay community is on the rise of late and I don't think it's necessarily anti-gay conspiracy ... I think what is happening is this: ecstasy has been around for a long time, but it was classified as a designer drug, it was not physically addictive, and you'd rarely see anyone running down the street with their television on their shoulder looking to buy a hit.Quote:
Originally Posted by jIgG
I went to my first party in June 1999 and tired E for the first time then. There are no more parties today than there were then, and the parties are not particularly bigger today. It is not any easier or harder to buy drugs now than it was then.
About a year after my first party, I started to notice the atmosphere at parties was changing. They used to be gigantic love-fests where everyone was friendly, they were hugging and bumping and grinding on the dance floor, by 2000 crystal meth starting making it's way into the party scene and the mood of the crowd started to get more aggressive. And it was introduced to the scene through E, that is, the produces of E started putting crystal in E to change the high experienced by comsumers. So the consumer would be more likely to exhibit jumpiness, bitchiness, moodiness, aggressiveness, and/or the grinding of their teeth. By 2003, I couldn't stant the parties anymore. The meth heads were too aggressive, too bitchy, and generally speaking not fun.
I had been complaining about meth since 2000, finally about 2003, the media started talking about it. It was the new shocker. I just sat there thinking, "Oh it's about time you covered this one, but why did you wait so long." But lo and behold, everyone thought it was this new horrible disease sweeping our community. It's not new, it's just new to you because THEY are talking about it and YOU are hearing it. Had you been going to parties you would have known about this all along.
The differences betwen E and meth is that meth is addictive, you will forget to go to work, when you do it you can't stop until you body shuts you down two days later out of exhaustion, and when you want more meth nothing is going to stop you, so this might lead you to crime.
What I do agree with is that people who are consuming meth are more likely to bareback because in the moment, whether they are positive or negative, the only thing they care about is getting another big, giant cock up their ass. Give it to me, I've got to have it, I need it now.
But people have been barebacking since they first started telling us to use condoms, but in more increasing numbers since the creation of the anti-viral "cocktail" which as soon as enough of them made it into production people started believing we had a cure.
dzinerbear
Amen. Some sanity. I'm HIV-positive, have been for 20 years. I have snorted crystal meth once and didn't care for it. My partner and I are currently in an open relationship, but for the most part, we are not having sex with other people. The option is there if we want it, we just tend not to exercise it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
Boyfunk, the scenarios you described surrounding porn producers are just plain WRONG and unethical. Any producer who tells an actor "here lets do this on the spot test" should be shot and pissed on. Unfortunately the types boyfunk describe do exist in this business, but I don't think one can say that all producers of bareback porn act this way. I think that anyone who is making bareback porn should be told nothing but the truth: if you're negative and you're doing this, you're considerably increasing your chances of contracting the HIV-virus. Period. There's nothing else to say.
dzinerbear
Damn you just get sexier and sexier you! :francais:Quote:
Originally Posted by desslock
Dzinerbear I think you're right about the porn producer stereotype and warning people about HIV risks when filming them in a bareback production. And DAMN 20 years?? That kicks ass! :pimp:
This has been a very interesting thread to participate in. After reading the various opinions I have learned a few things, but I still stand by my original thought.
I did not say that anyone who watches bareback porn is going to go out and have unsafe sex. I said that "bareback porn contributes to an overall attitude in our community that unprotected sex is without consequences - and that translates to more unsafe sex and more HIV / AIDS infections." There are many complex and overlapping reasons why a man will choose to have condomless sex in a given situation. (The biggest one is the mistaken belief that he and his partner have the same HIV status, which is usually impossible to know).
Nothing exists in isolation. Media affects attitudes and behaviors. The message of bareback porn is that fucking without a condom is hot, fun and preferable to sex with a condom; in an ideal, AIDS-free world there would be no harm to this message, but bareback porn celebrates the very act that is the major cause of HIV transmission in gay men. It may be satisfying to watch, it may not affect in any measurable way most of its fans, but I maintain that it makes the idea of unsafe sex more acceptable to some.
Perhaps condomless fucking needs to become "taboo" again if we are to ever win the fight against HIV/AIDS.
You people still don't get it..... it's not because of bareback videos that HIV exists, or it spreads....
"Sub-Saharan Africa has just over 10% of the worlds population, but is home to more than 60% of all people living with HIV."
You and your stupid bareback videos.... god ... people get a real life and face the real problems
Bareback, schmareback! Bareback vids are a tiny fraction of the gay adult video market. The latest fluff piece from ChiCHi is going to sell 1000 times more copies than the anything from Treasure Island or HDK. I would guess that the guys buying vids from HDK are well-informed mature men that are able to distinguish fantasy from reality. They are simply tired of the twink crap that all of the other video companies are producing. Rock on HDK, Treasure Island, Zyloco, SX Video, etc!
And please, give young people some credit. Every gay man knows how HIV is contracted, even if they are 18 and from Wisconsin.
Well, as someone who produces the "twink crap" you're referring to, follows video sales numbers, and talks to retailers and distributors regularly, I can tell you that every distributor and retailer I have spoken to (except for the few ethical ones that refuse to carry it) says that bareback content outsells non-bareback dramatically. This is true comparing safe and unsafe titles from the same producer, and there are even titles by tiny, unknown producers that are outselling major studio titles. This *is* a real problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
That is true, but you would be amazed at the denial that goes on. We discovered two of our models barebacking with each other off camera once, and we quietly sat them down and just told them the story of a couple of our other models (5 of them, now) that are all under 20 and had become HIV+, inQuote:
And please, give young people some credit. Every gay man knows how HIV is contracted, even if they are 18 and from Wisconsin.
two cases, after only 2 or 3 unsafe encounters. The models we spoke with were both pretty shocked. They'd allowed themselves to believe it only happened if you were doing it "a lot", or that they'd only get it if they were doing it with "older guys." Both came up to us separately later, and thanked us for illustrating the story so clearly. One said he was surprised and impressed that a porn producer would actually care about their models. And the other, whom we've kept in touch with, says he was scared shitless and hasn't been unsafe since.
So education DOES work.
And as to the meth/barebacking correlation: Our models seem to fall in two categories. More than half have never tried meth, and about 10-15% have never done any drugs at all. But a *huge* percentage of the ones that have never done meth do admit to barebacking or being willing to bareback under the right circumstances (really cute person asks them to, someone offers them enough $ to shoot a bareback scene, whatever.) And I would find it hard to argue that there isn't some correlation with what they see on the porn they view, in the same way there is a proven correlation between youth smoking rates and the presence of actors smoking on television and in films. So, like it or not, I think we do influence, unconsciously at least, the audience who views our content.
Everyone has to decide for him or herself, but in my book, anyone who denies that they are asking their models to puts their lives at risk by asking them to shoot bareback is kidding him or herself. And anyone who distributes, sells, views, or buys the content is contributing to that risk by supporting the practices of those producing the content.
Chip, i don't really know you - but after reading what you have to say in this post, i am very much looking forward to meeting you some day.
i've known a fair amount of adult performers, street workers, and just regular people who have amazing powers of denial. if you don't give them ALL the facts, they believe some things that people spread around because they don't want to believe the medical facts.
i know a guy who's been positive for a loooong time. he has a male and a female s/o, and they believe a movement by a disenfranchised doctor that you cannot get hiv through sex - none of them use condoms with each other or anyone else.
people, folks are dying out there who didn't believe hiv or hep c could happen to them! obviously if they really believed it would, they'd have wrapped that thing up in latex - very few of these people had a death wish. they just thought it wouldn't happen.
seriously - almost no one thinks a little more sensitivity is worth dying. they just convince themselves that it couldn't happen to them...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
you think?
"43% of 18-22 gay men have had unprotected sex in the last 6 months"
http://www.hivpositive.com/f-HIVyou/...n/YGMtext.html
as Jasun said on another board, certain studio told him they never tested anyone about HIV+ and just assumed all guys were, then asked him to do some videos.
the gay studios who do bareback are irresponsible, plain and simple. having untested people fucking bareback and insinuating "breeding" .... that sure sounds like something normal people would do :)
JIig, you've made a lot of good points.Quote:
Originally Posted by jIgG
Did you read the reference list on the above URL you gave to backup your stance? The most recent stastics quoted were 1994. It's difficult to be swayed to your point of view with 11 year old statistics. Do you have anything more recent to reference?
I apologize to anyone that I may have offended with my harsh words.
Nuff said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
ok there's 1)blood transfusion, 2)condom breaks accidentally & 3)not putting a condom on at all because they don't like, want it, don't care about HIV whatever.
1 and 2 people don't have control over, 3 .... well it sorta goes with promiscuos and irresponcible, assuming they're fucking someone they just met.
Not everyone who gets HIV deserves it, those in 1 & 2 definitly don't want it and it affects them negatively if they do.
3 is obviously either wanting it or don't care about it enough to put a rubber on and it's not a big deal to them if they get it because they want to do what feels good.
I'd much rather help 1 & 2, than 3 who just wants help to keep doing their thing for as long as possible.
So, if 3 - free for all, feels good, meant to be bare, HIV is no big deal, it's hot to get HIV+ - doesn't care why should I? Beyond the fact they might fuck other people and infect them?
http://www.geekslut.org/ - perfect example - he posted about fucking someone bareback and didn't tell them he was HIV+, not that the other person asked they were too drunk and drugged. But when someone reading the blog said he was irresponcible for doing it, his excuse was "my levels are undetectable I can't infect him" - right ............. :huh:
By saying 1&2 don't deserve it you are implying the #3 deserves it. No one deserves HIV! There are a few 'bug chasers' and 'gift givers' out there, but they are obviously mentally ill. Just because someone is careless once, twice or many times and whether the use drugs or not, it certainly doesn't mean they should contract a life threatening illness.Quote:
Originally Posted by jIgG
Imo, you need to be more compassionate and quit judging everyone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
You are VERY good at catching those dates on articles! ;-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jIgG
With every post you make, you make a bigger arsehole of yourself.
jigg - it ain't obvious, and it usually isn't true. lots of people who don't want to die don't use a condom and do care - but they have been given bad information or are being pressured. and never forget real desparation as a motive...
besides, these are our fellow humans. even the people who aren't that bright deserve compassion - imo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jIgG
I contracted HIV in late 1984 / early 1985 in a bath house because I wasn't using condoms in spite of having information that we probably should be using them. (At this time we still weren't completely sure how the HIV virus was transmitted, but it was looking more and more like it was through bodily fluids.) My self esteem at the time was such that I figure that if I demanded a partner put on a condom that he would leave my room. In other words, I believed at the time that I wasn't worth fucking and I needed to conform to whatever my partner wanted to do rather than doing what was best for myself. I also believed that getting fucked was the ultimate validation that I was worthy, likeable, or loveable.
Sad, but that's where I was. Jigg, I hope this example illustrates to you that you can't always look at a book's cover and know what is happening inside.
And I sure wish that you would realize that people have feelings and your approach is sometimes hurtful and mean spirited. I support your right to have your opinion, I just wish you could deliver it with more humanity.
And dalimil, I understand the passion with which you feeling your convictions, but calling someone an aresehole doesn't really help change anyone's position. It just makes them dig in further.
namaste
dzinerbear
Squirt asked for some more recent stats on gay men's unsafe sex practices. Here is a study that was just published that covers to 2000:
http://www.bananaguide.com/bgwire201.htm#young
Unsafe sex between young gay men is rampant.
I promote safer sex and safe sex (hand jobs baby!) all the time. To gay people and straight people. I go overboard with it, talking to everyone casually about it, just to put worries into their mind if they aren't there already, and hopefully just possibly make them a little more safe. So this thread has made me think hard about promoting any studios that sell bareback productions, and I don't want to. I was lightly promoting TI because I like Damon, but I'm convinced now that I might possibly be hurting someone, somewhere's outlook, ideas on safe sex, backing up the lies someone tells themself in situations I have no desire to influence, etc.
The bottom line is I couldn't hold any kind of small crappy check in my hand and know that I might have contributited in any large or small way to what any of you are describing in this thread, whether it's happening or not.
We all know how pop culture influences youth, in the way they dress, the way they speak, and yes, how they act. If being unsafe becomes the popular thing in culture, you can bet it has a HUGE influence. Anyone arguing against that is rationalizing it in a stupid way.
If I was a junkie, and I told myself "If I shoot up all the time in front of my young brother, it won't influence his feelings towards drugs in any way." who would I be kidding?
We all, as a community, have a HUGE responsibility to do everything we can to influence younger generations in good, healthy ways, and try to guide them to being healthy, happy adults, actively and passively, as in if you don't help don't harm either. That goes for what we create around them, how we interact with them personally, and what we actively or passively teach them is good, bad, right, wrong, safe, or unsafe.
Those who don't take these things into consideration are selfish, and put money, power, having a good time, whatever over the wellbeing of others. These are the types of people who are going to fuck up other people's lives, spread diseases, and basicly be assholes no matter what any of you say in a thread. Those that are still "on the fence" and can be influenced in any way by a thread like this are going to quickly and easily make the right decisions on these issues.
I'm babbling, but the point is, enough of these awful broken people exist that those of you with a conscience aren't going to be able to do much more than damage control, so if you aren't already, start attending fundraisers and doing what you can. We're all doomed.
Obviously HIV is the big issue, but what about syphilis? It should be popular to be EXTREMELY particular about who's cock people will or won't suck, after all your liver is pretty important. Are all these supposed "new" barebackers getting herpes and genital warts like crazy? If fucking anyone and everyone and just having a good time is so popular, how are there any gay guys left that aren't covered in nasty bumps and fighting off diseases all the time? Luck? I thought herpes and genital warts were pretty common, aren't they enough of a reason for guys to use condoms and be picky as fuck?
If you are gonna be picky about what you wear to the club, I don't see how you wouldn't be picky about who you bring home from the club and what you do with them. I've seen a huge upswing in prissy guys who seem to very highly value themselves since I came of age, so I don't see how guys are taking their day to day health less seriously, much less their life long health; ALL diseases are a big deal.
I am 1,000,000 % with you DigiJay.
I do live by the saying "B and Let B".
That doesn't mean I don't care about what others do.
I guess I understand what the Caliente who started the board said.
If he likes watching bareback porn that's kewl keep watching !
"that's hot" but seperate the fantasy from reality because it is
NOT safe.
Be Safe.
