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With the high number of knock off sites and production look-a-likes is it hard to confide in another webmaster out of marketing fear?
I’m working on the initial business plan of a new site and would like to toss it around with a few people to get feedback on various business modules and process implementations. Overall feel, interface ease and end user response. (Demo/product testing)
I guess I’m asking how do you know who to trust and what to dog-ear when you see it.
Experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by IdolKnights
There really isnt any other tried and trusted method to know who you can and cant trust in this industry unfortunately.
Just because i trust several people implicitly, doesnt mean that they will show you the same respect/trust that they show me. I would hope they would but that cant be guaranteed.
Regards,
Lee
I have only a few webmasters that I completely trust with my deepest secrets. Thankfully they can answer most any question and give me priceless advice.
Word of mouth.
Go with your gut.
If you have someone that you trust.. and they refer you to someone else, talk to them on the phone, feel them out, and test them with a small task or asking questions that you already know the answer to.
If people wont give you URLs of their work, refuse to discuss anything they're doing, or just pump you for a bunch of information, those are some red flags.
I've found through online networking that there are "veins" of good people who work together, just as there are "veins" of dubious people that work together. In most cases bird of a feather flock together.
Hope this helps.
its thanks to forums like these that you can get to know people a bit better and get a feel for trusting them. I have developed a number of good relations with quite a few people on this board.
cheers,
Luke
Ditto - the gut knows all!
And for those times when its (gut) only concern is being stuffed full o' yummies, I go with those I trust, which unfortunately is not many. Guess I've been exposed to too many freakin' lying cheating low-life bastards that easily use the louring phrase trust me that it (the phrase) now holds the same validity as 'teen', or 'twink'.
I've had issues with "trust" since the first day I entered this industry, ESPECIALLY when communicating via ICQ. Heck, I do not even maintain a large list - I delete IM contacts with no hesitation, as it is not my preferred method of yak yak.
Okay ... OKAY, I'll admit I often do fondle, and am often fondled by, some of the peeps here, but that's our little secret. Shit, I was not supposed to say that.
Know what really chafes my berries?
The unnecessary stroke session, many believe is necessary, prior to the pitch.
Fucking kuhryst, it's business! I expect peeps want to exchange (biddiness), so quite with the pretentious crap and stop dry humping my leg. <-- Shit like that builds distrust!
My playful actions are genuine, but others abuse the word (play). I do not fondle and run as others do (hands down my pants and the moment something is struck, POOF they are not to be heard or seen, that is until they need more (traffic etc).
Way to build a nice trusting relationship. I do trust that type will stick their tongue in my ear prior to my hearing their gentle whisper for more.
We never TRUST anyone, however - we enjoy doing business most with webmasters we have met at events, or those that are active on boards we find trustworthy.
This is indeed a tough one. Bec and xstr8guy were probably two webmasters that I reached out to initially. I asked xstr8guy for some advice on something to do with the real man market and it turned out that he had always wanted to talk to me. From there we started chatting and sharing information, and when neither of us screwed the other, our trust grew. Then we started sharing about others: so-and-so is a good one to talk to about that, that sort of thing. If xstr8guy trusts them, then that's good enough for me.
Likewise with Bec, I asked for advice about my site, she gave me some good pointers that really boosted my income and she helped me a lot. Over time a nice relationship grew where we'd share about others: stay away from him, he'll rip you blind or I had a really good experience with this guy, same sort of thing. Bec's got me some paying gigs because her clients trust her. And likewise, I've sent some work Bec's way.
xstr8guy and I compete in the same market, but we don't compete with one another. We share resources, sometimes buy content together, and cross link our sites. If I can't get the sale, I'd rather he have it.
So I think it's a matter of trial and error and time. Reach out to someone and see what happens. Try and follow up quickly on whatever it is that you're supposed to do. I think that's the biggest indicator. If someone doesn't do something they said they would, some flags should start going up. If it happens consistently, then you have your answer. Once you've established a good working relationship with one person, you'll start to enlarge your contacts into their circle of friends and contacts.
Cheers,
Michael
there use to be a time when i would give someone the shirt off my back but i've come to realize sometime ago that some want a pair of pants to go with that shirt.
i believe in contracts , i believe in 50/50 (give/take) , i believe in when in doubt the answer is always no.
i'm very personable and will answer most questions you have but if i don't get a response and/or find you more asking than contributing then you are something i have no time for.
sincerely ~ ..."meet me in the middle" - gladys knight
I think trust goes a long way but you have to be careful who you trust. Alot of us never meet but you still have to trust one another in alot of ways. I would try to confide in people you have known for awhile and you feel comfortable with.
Mark
i haven't noticed that webmasters are any less trustworthy than any other group of people. on the other hand, trust should be based on prior experiences with any person. once you have a fair sized history with someone, you can see if they've been acting in a way you consider trustworthy.
even so, a contract couldn't hurt.
when i try Dzinerbear's version of trial and error, i make sure in the early parts of a relationship that the things i trust the webmaster with are smaller things. that way, if they do mess up or not do what they said they would, i'm not totally screwed.
when it comes to letting someone install something, i go with many references from people i do and don't know and then i talk to the person who would be doing the actual install. i know over 100 people with strongbox and i also talked to ray who personally installed it for us.
I think the "anonymity" of the online world tends to bring out scammers, I always find it suss when you can't even find out a person's real name. :fugly:Quote:
Originally Posted by basschick
If you are looking for trust in the online world, look at how eBay pioneered the ability to assign a trust level to their buyers and sellers.
As a result, sellers with lots of positive comments by their name, versus a new seller, routinely get 10 - 20% higher on their auction items. So, who works with others in public and gets high marks, versus someone else who stays mysterious and cloaked?
If you are seeking people you can trust, I would try to follow the same pattern, and use this as yardstick to guage the individuals with whom you choose to do business.
Steve
Yah know, in the past I've asked webmasters if they'd be interested in making a list of thieving webmasters, but that was not so popular - man did I get roasted!
Sadly, too many WM are worried about "buring bridges", that this beautiful concept would never fly, in our industry.
*placing unit on yard stick*Quote:
Originally Posted by desslock
How you trust me now?
(Sorry, could not help myself.)
The problem we run into here is webmasters simply changing their names and attaching it to a new site of theirs. It's been done before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paco
Too correct!Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirt
We ran across that problem back when we offered opt-in: it started with me maintaining a list of WM that breached out terms. Once we realized MANY were joining, again, under different names, we started tracking everything such as IPs, their webmaster IDs for other sponsors et cetera. Things got a little out of control, so we simply dump the program.
I go by something like PageRank :D
If to me trustworthy people say "hey, guy X is a good guy" I might as well try... on the other hand if those trustworthy people say "Dude Y is a piece of shit - stay away" I consider that as well - as well as connections to him -likewise with positive remarks about a person.
People tend to surround themselves with people of their kind.
It’s nice to see a few viewpoints on the subject.
I guess in the long run I need to put my neck out and go from there. You can only find people to work with if you approach people to work with and build trust from there.
Maybe a Bump for this topic too?
*printing new sticker for my car*
Nice bumper!
Mind if I slam it?
Oh, so to add to this thread: I believe too many people become blinded by profit/money that they unknowingly let their guard down.
Even worse, other people know that and take advantage of the above person/s greed.
Theres a lot of good trustworthy peeps on boards - just gotta fish them out.
Just remember that condoms make the best bait!Quote:
Originally Posted by Togm
trust and respect are BIG ISSUES - business people tend to show their true colors under pressure - some show leadership and others scatter like roaches
situations that need immediate and pro-active decisions can separate the men from the boys - its all about rolling up the sleeves to pitch in and get things done on a TEAM basis - for the common goal and purpose (in our case, us!)
I ALWAYS distrust people who, from the very start, promise this and that and promise big and grand returns - this leads me to believe that they have no clue as to who we are and what we do - because they are only out for themselves and a quick buck
we have developed some sound relationships with people on this board - and are grateful to Bec, Patti, KC Webwerks, TomBar and a many other decent professionals that have a willingness to share and help - from the heart - these folks clearly understand the meaning of sharing info and knowhow for the collective good - what we do (Cam and I) as a result of this knowledge translates into work and $$$, etc. etc. - likewise for others
beware of those who want to take, take, take... my 3¢