Interesting Conversation I Just Had On AIM About Straight Webmasters..

With so many of them these days marketing to gay surfers in addition to their straight ones, why dont more of them post on the various gay message boards?

Im personally of the belief that they dont post on gay boards for the age old reason that they somehow think they will be looked down upon by their straight peers in the industry and that somehow that will effect them on a social level.

The person i was chatting to on AIM was of the belief that despite the fact they 'sell cock' to gay surfers, a lot of them are still on a basic level, homophobic, and well i just dont buy that, the same way i dont buy that a programs needs to have someone 'gay' running their gay sites, they just need someone with an understanding of marketing.

Was just curious to find out why some of you folks thought more straight webmasters, who do market to gay surfers, dont post on any of the gay webmaster forums that are around right now?

Your thoughts on this?

I also know we have a few straight individuals posting on GWW so it would be interesting to hear from you guys (and gals) also about this topic if you wouldnt mind chiming in a little :)

Regards,

Lee

I would definitely say there is at least discomfort, if not downright homophobia among a fair number of webmasters.

I've been at small industry events where we were the only gay people there, and the only people with a gay program there... and while people were reasonably friendly, it was pretty clear they weren't the least bit comfortable with gay stuff. When we offered to show our "shameless promotion" (the little cards describing the sites), all the guys were like "Oh, that's OK, I don't need to see that."

I find that rather amusing because (a) it's not like I'm scarred or offended by looking at tits or snatch and (b) all these damn webmasters have dicks and asses themselves, and they've certainly cum a few times, so I don't really get why it's scary to look at a picture with dicks in it.

There are alot of two faced webmasters out there, happy to take the pink dollar but not comfortable with the gay community. Look at gyf, a few of them promote gay sites then come out with crap on the boards.

I think all of that will change simply because it has to.

a lot of webmasters promote shemale sites but don't go to shemale boards, or promote bbw sites without going to bbw boards and so on. most webmasters either hang out with a particular clique or go to where their buddies are.

also most webmasters are lazy. they'll promote niches and markets they don't understand as long as it's easy. actually going to where webmasters are who are successful in those markets and niches - that rarely happens.

sure, there are some homophobic assholes out there, but of the people i know personally, lack of interest or motivation is what keeps them posting at the same boards.

Well, the webmasters that promote shemales make a lot of noise about it on AWM boards and are fairly active in the shemales webmasters boards (not surfers boards). I think once it became a consensus that shemales isn't gay, and is more like "girls with strapons", some of the straight guys got more comfortable with it.

I market both straight and gay porn and I try to hang around both kinds of webmasters boards. I have to say, generally speaking, the atmosphere in gay webmasters boards is much nicer for me, as a straight female webmaster. I get my kind of eye candy every now and then :D Also, I don't get threads like "Would you fuck this girl?" and so feel less excluded, if that makes sense. On the other hand, it's harder to flirt with gay webmasters (though not impossible!) and just flaunting my boobs around doesn't get me links lol.

I have to say though, yes, I think many straight male webmasters are homophobic, especially Americans. I get these kind of responses when I show them a FS or a gallery for feedback. Sometimes I don't even remember it's "gay" and they go "ewwwww, don't be showing me dick, girl!"

It's not just the "gay factor", it's the anything other than straight factor. That is the main reason that roy and I are BDSM Lite, when attending any industry event.

Example:YP 2005

We had a room full of webmasters enjoying Coffee Talk w/ Madame one AM. One of the ladies said ... "Wish I had a dick". Of course roy pipes up .. "hang on, I'll get one of Madame's strap-ons.

Can you say .. Pin Drop?

Now on the other side of the coin, I'm hanging out with a bunch of gay web masters with their tasty models, and say pussy. Man it sounded like a bunch of Jr High girlies, who just saw a mouse.

Hell, I'd NEVER use roy as a submissive, around any of you! :whip:

:fool:
People are Strange!

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Originally Posted by Madame0120

I

Now on the other side of the coin, I'm hanging out with a bunch of gay web masters with their tasty models, and say pussy. Man it sounded like a bunch of Jr High girlies, who just saw a mouse.

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I took several of our models to this really nice hippie-clothing-optional hot springs place (which translates to nudist, because about 1 person out of 200 wears clothes). It was really funny, one of the models was literally scared out of his mind at seeing the naked women there. He was saying "omg! I've never actually seen a pussy! Those are scaring me!"

I was trying to explain that they wouldn't bite (and trying to keep from laughing) but he was actually serious.

Definitely one has to be aware of one's environment :)

Lee,

I would certainly agree with you on many of the points you made in your above statement.

I'm betting there are quite a few people who are way too uncomfortable with themselves to say they post at a "gay" website even though they promote gay/lesbian. I'm straight, but you know me, I have been working with you for years. So if I can handle being very comfy working around you, jeeeesh, I can pretty much handle anything right :)

Lee, I believe you are correct, about the fear of being shunned, but not only by their peers. It goes deeper that just the internet!

They supply themselves with their own ultimate excuse: they can promote the "evil" action because they are profiting from it. I think it is truly sad how so many go against their "normal" ways merely to earn an extra buck!

As for "peers": I constantly harassed for coming hither and playing with those that allow me to! I am constantly being supplied with my additions (text) to this board because people are shocked that I can play the way I do - my use of words eek them! I guess that means not many are as carefree and open-minded enough.

I strongly believe I am the opposite of most simply because I seriously do not give a f__k & a half about what most of the people in this industry think, let alone feel --- most are beyond too prehistoric for me to bother with. THAT, plus the fact that I do not believe there is such a thing as god allows me to dispense with the many traditional "borders" and views held by others. Thusly, I travel freely!

Many others do no not, so they cannot!

I sure hope hell freezes over soon, 'cause I am in the express lane speeding my way there!

I think one reason straight webmasters dont post on gay wm boards is because most of them spend little time on gay sites or projects.

I def. agree though that there is a fair amount of homophobia or just plain machismo or whatever you want to call it.

However, I have to say that the team at WEG Cash including Cory, John, Gabe and Ruth are super cool and totally fine with gay content, even if they are straight. So we got to give props to the breeders who deal with gay content and are very respectful about it :cheerleader:

I think it's a lot simpler than homophobia, though that is probably a part of it. But I think it's probably more motivated by the fact that most people stick to what they know best, and the straight webmasters just don't know that much about the gay market. So they either hire guys like Mathieu at Braincash, Eddie at Video Secrets and Robert at SilverCash to "do their dirty work" for them, or they just don't do it.

Many of the straight webmasters I meet are very friendly and welcoming to me. True, some of the guys don't want to be bothered with looking at pics of gays fucking, but then again, I have no desire to look at a woman's snatch either, so it runs both ways.

Or maybe straight webmasters just don't like being referred to as breeders.

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Originally Posted by gmartin

Or maybe straight webmasters just don't like being referred to as breeders.

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LOL! Exactly. The more we perpetuate an "us and them" mentality by assuming that they are homopobic just because they aren't that familiar with our product, the more engender seperation between gay and straight webmasters.

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Originally Posted by gmartin

Or maybe straight webmasters just don't like being referred to as breeders.

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I dont think ive ever seen anyone on GWW seriously refer to a straight wm as a 'breeder' in a negative way.

Regards,

Lee

well, I am sure as hell offended - I did not spend the cash to get :bananacock: snipped :bananacock: for nothing!

just kidding, about being offended - it (breeding) means as much as the act (breeding) does to me ... nothing!

I wish it were that simple: str8s use one offensive term, and gays another to describe the other.

However, it is not! It is the str8s with offensive anti-gay sigs that I see all the time and rarely do I see it the other way!

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Originally Posted by JohnV

So if I can handle being very comfy working around you, jeeeesh, I can pretty much handle anything right :)

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Ssshhhh.. People might get the wrong idea LOL

But yeah you're right :)

Regards,

Lee

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Originally Posted by Lee

I dont think ive ever seen anyone on GWW seriously refer to a straight wm as a 'breeder' in a negative way.

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I think that's part of the problem, not seeing that the term itself is flat-out offensive. I'm a "straight" person who spends a lot of time in gay spaces, both online and off, where the term is used negatively or without any thought behind it and you would not believe some of the violent reactions I've been on the receiving end of for calling someone on it, so I'm not really commenting on GWW alone.

Regardless of intent, the use of such an expression creates a less than welcoming environment, much like the mocking that occurs on places like GFY would create a less than welcoming environment for gay webmasters. From my perspective I see a lot of "pot, kettle, black" behavior within both communities generally, though there may be little such occurrence on this particular board.

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Originally Posted by gmartin

Regardless of intent, the use of such an expression creates a less than welcoming environment, much like the mocking that occurs on places like GFY would create a less than welcoming environment for gay webmasters. From my perspective I see a lot of "pot, kettle, black" behavior within both communities generally, though there may be little such occurrence on this particular board.

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I agree completely. Gay webmasters are always complaining about how alienated they feel from GFY and other "straight" forums, but I think gay forums are just as guilty of the same offenses.

gmartin - I strongly disagree.

I belong to many ski forums and I never see the gay skiers hound the heteros, it is only the other way.

As a matter of fact; once the members found out I worked in the industry and that we have gay sites I was harassed, big time.

Basically: Paco Like Gay Porn.

Matters not to me what some ass-backward country bumping-with-his-kin thinks. What bothered me was the size of the crowd that turned up for the lynching. Worse part - even the gay members were too afraid to come-out for fear they would be roasted ... by people that truly hate them.
Makes total fucking sense to me!

A mainstream board's mod allows signatures such as:
telemarkers are fags because they are always on their knees

AND (of course) many are very "christian".

Sorry, but I do not see heterosexuals receiving as much flack!
p.s. I am!

I'm straight and I have no problem posting over here. Buisness is business. There are some really great discussions and information over here.
More straight run gay programs really owe it to themselves to post more often in forums like this one to gain more knowledge and establish new buisness partners.
Sexinc.com has always been big on the gay side of the business, what with running Chisel.com since the mid 90's, and now that we're back with a new program, it's onward and upward from here!

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Originally Posted by Lee

I dont think ive ever seen anyone on GWW seriously refer to a straight wm as a 'breeder' in a negative way.

Regards,

Lee

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Oh?
:rolleyes:

I'd like to see where the use of the term "breeder" was used in a positive light. Kinda like my GrandMother Daisy saying ... he's such a nice lil ****** boy.

Geeze you guys! Take the high road for once. No matter the generation, or century .. two wrongs will NEVER make a right. The moment a person starts calling names, they loose their creditability, and prove how ignorant they truly are.

:nobody: And Nobody can fix the problems of bigotry, if the perpetuate it!

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Originally Posted by d@sexinc

Chisel.com since the mid 90's, and now that we're back with a new program, it's onward and upward from here!

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I ran through the tour .. sorry to be off topic - is it common to offer only one membership option - that is auto rebilled? Just curious.

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Originally Posted by Madame0120

I'd like to see where the use of the term "breeder" was used in a positive light. Kinda like my GrandMother Daisy saying ... he's such a nice lil ****** boy.

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Ive never seen it used positively or negatively on GWW.

It has however been used to say things like 'breeder is the equivalent of fag' as you'll notice by running a quick search :)

Now, on the other hand, go to any of the straight boards on BoardTrackers top 10 list and do a search for 'fag' or 'fags' and you'll see the complete opposite ;)

Regards,

Lee

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Originally Posted by Paco

gmartin
Sorry, but I do not see heterosexuals receiving as much flack!
p.s. I am!

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Stupid ppl Paco .. they are the bane of our new century! Everyone seems so intent on casually hurting each other. It's a wonder humans can even stand in line at Micky D's together.

:nobody:

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Originally Posted by Lee

Now, on the other hand, go to any of the straight boards on BoardTrackers top 10 list and do a search for 'fag' or 'fags' and you'll see the complete opposite ;)

Regards,

Lee

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That's the #1 reason 90% of MY fourm time and energy is spent on 3 boards. Forums like GYF just amaze me. From my experience, it isn't the ppl who show up to events and are visable in the business who post that shit. It's them dumb-assed keyboard warriors spewing hate. They remind me of all the 15 year olds I've ever fed, who parrot hate words and fling them without knowing who they might hurt.

In our Home, each and every one of them learned the lesson of - think before you speak, or they were no longer welcome.

Sigh ...
:nobody:

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Originally Posted by Madame0120

I ran through the tour .. sorry to be off topic - is it common to offer only one membership option - that is auto rebilled? Just curious.

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We used to have a trial, but nixxed it a couple of months ago to see what it would do. Conversions have been better since, and retention has increased slightly over all.
We don't have a ton of affiliates yet, (Still looking for a few good sources of quality traffic, hint hint) as the program was revamped and relaunched in October as a 70% Recurring Rev Share, so all we really have to go on stats wise is our own in house traffic and type ins. Chisel.com has always performed well though, and this month it's averaging 1:96.

Well the original question was, out of webmasters who sell gay porn, why don't they post on gay boards...

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Originally Posted by Lee

Was just curious to find out why some of you folks thought more straight webmasters, who do market to gay surfers, dont post on any of the gay webmaster forums that are around right now?

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So it's hard for me to believe that webmasters who sell gay porn, for the most part, are homophobic or disgusted by gay porn.

I'm straight, I promote some gay sites, and I post here occasionally. I'm not homophobic, and I get a kick out of the gay slogans you put in everyone's title :drunk: I agree with basschick, webmasters don't necessarily post on boards about each market (or niche) they promote.

As far as the breeder thing goes, I doubt that offends most straight people or prevents them from posting. I did not even know that was a derogatory term until someone ragged on boyalley for using it once.

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Originally Posted by slaxxx

As far as the breeder thing goes, I doubt that offends most straight people or prevents them from posting. I did not even know that was a derogatory term until someone ragged on boyalley for using it once.

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I agree, the term "breeder" doesn't offend me in the slightest. Could be called alot worse. Heh.

Paco is proud to boast that he internets #1 :fool: !
:cheerleader: