How would you best protect your content? Is it indeed hopeless?
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How would you best protect your content? Is it indeed hopeless?
If money were no object I'd protect my content via an unbreakable seemless DRM that would last forever on the subscribers computer so they could view as much as they want. The DRM would also know when it was being transferred to the same users new computer, and still work forever there. The DRM would know when being transferred to a friends computer and would last 24 hours there before making itself an ad for my site.
The DRM would also report to my attorney who uploaded to file sharing sites and the subscribers name, phone number, CC number and address, automatically. :sunny:
BTW... perhaps we could all start incorporated in our TOS a clause stating "if you are found to have uploaded content to a file sharing site you agree to have automatically charged to your CC acount $1,000 per incident, or per day the content remains on the file sharing site, whichever is greater"
If money were no object, I guess I would just build a private "website" with exclusive content that was not even connected to the internet.
Let's see the hackers get to THAT!
:thumbsup:
I personally think that content sharing is going to happen no matter what, we have groomed the surfer in to thinking they can get as much porn as they want for free over the last 10 years to the point where they have a sense of entitlement that what they are doing ISNT wrong, which we have seen time and time again over the past week based on some of the sites we've seen posted and the responses seen by those stealing the content.
Until we [as an industry] start limiting the flow of free content that surfers have access to, filesharing is going to be a major problem that each and every one of us is going to have to adapt to and find a way to profit from.
There are also methods of making filesharing harder, in the sense that if the surfer cant physically download the content they want easily, they may well abandon all attempts at stealing it, streaming content instead of allowing it to be downloaded, disabling context menus in HTML, hiding the source of true images by placing transparent overlays above them, etc.
The biggest thing we have to do as an industry is work out how we can start to profit from these types of site, rather than continue fighting the good fight in getting our content removed from them.
As we have seen over the last few days on GWW, content gets taken down, then 24 hours+ later, it re-emerges again as if nothing was wrong, its a constant sturggle between defending our copyrights, wasting time fighting the content theives and losing revenue because of content theft, yet the battle would be won if we could between oursleves, figure out a way to actually take these image theives and profit from them, and the people who support them, something that as of yet, a lot of people in the adult industry dont understand to be a solid, long-term business goal.
Regards,
Lee
Union Union Union!
I think a combination of strategies will be helpful.
-- A group of webmasters (or studios) that band together and start targeting companies like Rapidshare
-- Using technology like Digimarc's invisible watermarking, which is associated with an individual member, and then when that content shows up shared, taking aggressive action against the member for sharing (perhaps using the statutory $25,000 per infringement of a copyrighted work)
-- Using emerging technologies like Adobe's new DRM for Flash to make it harder to steal in the first place.
Dont you just love the irony of discussing content theft and posting an image you dont have the rights to? ;) LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
Regards,
Lee
Porn content sharing started with surfers downloading content from paysites and sharing it with eachother on forums. Porn content sharing began with stolen content, then we as an industry started giving away promo content as incentive, now some surfers believe ALL content is theirs if they can find a place to get it for free.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Filesharing will always be a problem, it will always exist, just as people copying tapes and movies has always existed. The reason modern filesharing the problem is the thief isn't getting a second rate copy of the music/video, they are getting a perfect copy and that leaves no incentive to buy the content.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
I agree. Also uploading massive dummy copies to torrentz that have randomly adjusted file sizes will help. But sites like rapidshare are more difficult... possibly an industry liason with rapishare and other file sharing sites will help?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
I agree. Forum sites want to make money and don't like having to setup house over and over again. There is plenty of room for making money on all ends if they would be open to adjusting their business model, which I think will be difficult to do.
Jim isn't far wrong. The adult industry is unorganized. What can we do one site at a time? It's like trying sending the poor little Dutch boy off to plug a dyke that has sprung major Swiss cheese leaks.
Let's say 100 gay porn sites got together and pooled their resources and hired someone to start launching lawsuits and filing cease and desist orders. I imagine the file-sharing organizations would stand up and take notice if they started getting sued by a 100-member organization. As well, if individual surfers started getting served for sharing or downloading stolen content, much like the music industry did, things might begin to change.
But Lee is right, the surfers have been trained for a long time to expect not to have to pay for porn, so they feel their entitled to steal it.
The download everything you want for $24.95 kind of sites are also a problem. Once you let your content out of the barn, it's worthless.
BTW, why do sponsors allows affiliates to promote their sites on password sharing sites? Why isn't every sponsor with a banner of this site
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Sean Cody / Randy Blue / Corbin Fisher...
You have an affiliate sharing membership passwords while promoting your sites... http://www.kikipasses.com not contacting the corresponding affiliate and cancelling their account? Seems to me you can't complain about thief, but then, make money off of it.
Michael
Yes. Yes, I do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
LOL just fucking with ya buddy :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
Regards,
Lee
I know two adult sites that have been welcomed into the class action suit against YouTube for copyright infringement. There is room for plenty more. Yes, the attorneys will get the lions share, but this about stopping something which is more important than anything else.
More of our password traders can be traced back to kikipasses than any other.
Certainly there is not fool proof method to stop the theft, but the idea that they are getting the orignial quality content is the most disturbing.
As dvd sales continue to fall and more and more of us make our content available for sale online, the practice is going to get even worse.
How does I-tunes do it so well?
A reminder...if you are not getting a copyright on your materials, you are late out the gate.
But didn't that image make you want to go out and rent 'Norma Rae' again? See, no one was harmed by my actions. In fact, the local Blockbuster may benefit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Just don't go looking for a copy on rapidshare! :anger:
iTunes, in reality, cant be compared to normal 'content' because they have 1 primary advantage over everyone else publishing content, either on the web, dvd, cd, etc, they have a HUGE captive audience plus they are one of maybe 2-3 sites legally selling said 'content'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex_Manifest_M
The one thing i really like about the iTunes business model is that it actually worked for the music industry in making songs and movies available to everyone at a relatively cheap price, most songs are available for download and can be used on 5 machines when purchased from iTunes at $1 a pop, most movies can be downloaded and used on 5 machines for $10 a pop, both of those price points are considerably cheaper than buying a single or album or new release DVD.
Right now, the current PPV business model we have is heading in the right direction but it still falls short, as the movies cant be 'saved' on the users computer... Again, a big issue with DRM abuse by the content distributors.
DRM in and if itself could have been a great marketing tool, unfortunately it got abused by companies to the point where its never going to become a positive thing in the eyes of the surfer.
DRM should be used to allow a surfer/member to download a movie and keep it, so long as the DRM data packet remains on that users PC, even after they have cancelled their membership, instead, the second a membership to any of the sites utilizing DRM is cancelled, the content becomes unusable.... About as far away from the iTunes business model as we could possibly get LOL
Regards,
Lee
...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
The external hardware unit for storage, playback to companion their site: iPod
I am completely behind the idea that the content becomes unusable once the membership is terminated. The content in our membership area is for rent, it is not for sale. Otherwise, there is no reason to even continue a membership. I believe that is a flaw that was built into the overall membership model from day one. If you pay Blockbuster for a movie, you can't go in there and bitch because you could not copy the movie. We have all read this example: Join a site for 20 bucks that has 300 videos for for 15 cents each. Next month they add 6 more for which you pay 3.30 each. So why not wait 6 months and get a big pile of videos for a low unit cost again? Bounce from site to site till your hard drives are bloated and you then upload the entire library to RapidShare deleting the ones that are not our absolute favorites and start again.
It all depends on how we as site owners value our product. Manifest videos are not easily downloaded by people who don't surf the net looking for instructions. Yet our retention rate is fantastic. But since day one we have made it clear that the videos are being rented not sold. This has cost us a ton of points at review sites which continue to pursue the notion that content should be downloaded and kept by members. This sense of entitlement is being perpetrated by our industry and it is biting us in the ass. This "all you can eat buffet" is turning our sites into the Golden Coral. If we do not respect our content, if we do not place a high value on it, why should the public.
Therein lays the problem with DRM abuse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex_Manifest_M
You asked why iTunes was so successfull, you got given the answer and didnt like it. The fact is, surfers have the mindset where they are 'buying' the content NOT renting it which is where filesharing starts happening.
A business model like iTunes whereby the member has access to whatever content they download and after they cancel that content is still usable so long as the DRM license information is stored on their machine is what iTunes does, that is why iTunes is so successfull, its buy to own (with limitations), not buy to rent (with limitations).
You used the analogy of Blockbuster movie rentals, Blockbuster are actually starting to migrate away from the traditional movie 'rental' business model and will be launching a download to own business model within the next 12-36 months, just like Vongo, they have to if they are to stay in business, just like we have to adapt if we're to stay in business.
Regards,
Lee
It is not a question of liking the answer. You are answering a different question in my opinion. If you sell a clip then it is sold. You can not go to the itunes store and download the entire library for one fee. The model is not the same thing. We will soon offer surfers the option as members to buy the clips in full quality with digital watermark at a reasonable cost. But we are talking about membership sites. We are not talking about online stores. That is the big problem. They are not the same thing.
You are right they arent, but to the people that matter, the surfers, they ARE the same thing in their minds, they dont differeciate between 'renting' and 'purchasing'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex_Manifest_M
A surfer expects to go to a porn site and download ALL of the members area content for $30.... Because that is what they are told they can do when they join 'download billions of images and movies'. They arent told 'download billions of images and movies and as soon as you cancel they become unusable'.
A surfer expects to go to iTunes and pay $1 for 1 song. Thats just what they get.. One song.
We need to adapt our business practices to start getting the surfer in the mindset that porn site members areas are no different to iTunes but we arent going to be able to do that so long as they keep getting screwed with DRM that cancels the usability of the content the second their membership ends.
Regards,
Lee
Can't you set the DRM license to never expire? I'm pretty sure I've heard of that being done. But maybe the Xanax just kicked in... I shouldn't be posting while sedated. :drunk:
You can yes, its what iTunes does, thats what im saying, in itself DRM ISNT bad, a member of a paysite can download content and even after their membership has ended, still use the content, so long as the license information is located on their machine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xstr8guy
DRM has become a 'bad' thing because it was used to FORCE members to keep rebilling to continue using the content.... Thats why surfers dont like it.
Regards,
Lee
People are used to buying and owning music, there is no real history of renting music. They are however used to renting films and DVDs, as well as purchasing and owning them.
The problem becomes one of marketing and how you present the various purchase offers to the consumer. As long as you are honest and give people the information upfront about what it is they are really getting then you should not have much problem.
You have to be very clear and honest with your customers. The hype may get them in the door, but if they feel tricked they are not going to stay around very long. All you can do is give them the information upfront so they can make an informed purchasing decision. If they only want to "own" the files and you only allow "viewing rights", then they need to know up front so they can make their decision. Better to lose a customer upfront then have a pissed off one later on.
But again, specifically with Flash DRM, its going to be abused, meaning that within 6 months of it being adopted, it will be looked at as a bad thing by surfers because Flash DRM will be used by most program owners as yet another way to try and force the member to continue rebilling.Quote:
Originally Posted by gaybucks_chip
In my opinion, forcing a member to continue rebilling using DRM or the content becomes unviewable, is no different to what used to happen with dubious companies continuing to bill the surfer even after they cancelled their membership... Another reason why 'rebilling' is looked at as a bad thing by the surfer.
Regards,
Lee
In my opinion it is all about setting and meeting expectations. I was a member of many sites prior to entering this business 2.5 years ago and never felt that I was my right to harvest the videos on a site for my own use after my membership expired. I certainly never saved them and then gave them to others for free. Hell I paid, why shouldn't they.
"That which costs you nothing is worth exactly nothing to you" Grandfather was a smart man.
Flash DRM technology would work for PPV. Perhaps all paysites should convert to PPV.. sounding better every day but lack of rebills would suck SO run high quality PPV with DRM and a paysite with the same content but smaller resolution :drunk:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
What do ya think?