Do you have less respect for a straight person if they work within the gay internet community?
Do you have less respect for a straight person if they work within the gay internet community?
Absolutely not!
The only reason I wouldn't respect a person in your position is if you were just trying to sell me a product then disrespecting me afterwards (aka sell gay feeds and not be accepting and supportive of the gay community - sell gay content and go gay bashing - you can see what I'm saying).
Mind you there are those people in the community who will not work with straight people. It's a fact of life for some. You are going to see it in places. It's not a way of doing business that I would choose, but I have to respect those people for their decisions.
GWW is made up of a diverse group (gay, bi, transgender, straight, etc) who are here to do business. And I think I can say in large part a person doing business is respected on how well they do their job not who they sleep with.
My two cents ;)
Gary-Alan
If you don't mind me asking Derek, How did this question come into your mind?Quote:
Originally posted by Content Guy Derek
Do you have less respect for a straight person if they work within the gay internet community?
Thanks for asking that Tia LOL As I wrote my response above that exactly what I was thinking. ;)
Gary-Alan
No, I don't, not at all.
What is bothering me, however, is the recently spat of straight webmasters popping in here with questions like: what's the best selling gay niche or who are highest converting sponsors? It reminds me of people popping into the search engine board and asking: How do I get a top ten ranking in Google?
It seems that things are drying up in the straight market, or it's getting harder to make money, and so those webmasters are turning to the gay market to shore up their revenues. That in itself isn't a problem, but there seems to be this underlying perception that they can just tromp over here, find the magic formula, buy some pictures, and presto! the money starts rolling in.
I find that a little insulting, first, as a webmaster who has busted his ass of for the past year trying to figure out the bear and uncut niches; and second, as a gay man, who knows there's much more to selling gay sites than talking about "big cocks."
While I don't think you need to be gay to market to the gay audience, I do think it helps. I wouldn't know the first thing about selling straight porn and I wouldn't expect to be successful at it unless I was prepared to put in a lot of hours learning about a specific niche and trying to climb into the buyer's head and figure out how and why it turns them on.
Cheers
Dzinerbear
Hey Derek welcome to GWW its nice tog et you finally posting here :thumbsup:
The only way i would have less respect for YOU is you just rolled over and started snoring ;)
Seriously though i think GA hit the nail on the head :)
Again nice to have you hear and i LOVE the new squirts feed :)
Regards,
Lee
Derek,
Very interesting question and very good responses so far as well.
Derek, when it comes down to it, respect & trust is the basis on any relationship business or personal.
Since we're talking business here, if you work for a company with
questionable business practices and policies then your personal sexual preference will not allow you escape that shadow. People may
socialize more with you at the 'meet and greet functions' and while you may distribute and collect your share of business cards, but that doesn't mean anyone will be sending traffic your way once they get home. Likewise, a personal reputation of being less then above board will not compensate for working for a great company regardless of being str8 or gay.
I also think there is a big difference in attitude and respect here.
Specifically, if a company produces a quality product that delivers, that's very different then just slapping something together and rolling it out as if from, out of the blue, it is the next great thing when there's clearly been no research or real effort put into it other then the minimum as an obvious attempt to just ”make some money off the fags."
The proof they say is in the pudding however. Craig and Dwayne from ManSites, whose personal preferences are dry-docked in land of the heterosexual, come to mind immediately as two universally respected, trusted and well liked members of the gay internet community.
In other words... it's what you do and how you do, not who you do, that earns respect
Unless the said straight webmasters have a lot of gay traffic.Quote:
Originally posted by Gary-Alan
Mind you there are those people in the community who will not work with straight people.
In which case the gay companies who refuse to work with straight webmasters throw their beleifs out of the window to get more gay traffic LOL
That happens a lot more than most would realize and in fact, some of those companies and individuals will often be seen saying that sraight webmasters should have nothing to do with the gay side of the industry.
Unfortunately for them, there are those of us who dont beleive that someones sexual orientation should have any affect on who we do or dont do business with i think Harlan put it best, its who you are and how you do business that influences if *I* will do business with you not who you do (or dont) sleep with.
Regards,
Lee
Harlan - I love that line.Quote:
Originally posted by Harlan
In other words... it's what you do and how you do, not who you do, that earns respect
GA
I've added it to my quotable quotes page, it's cool Harlan.
MY $0.02
I believe that it shouldn't matter if you are straight, gay , bi or transgender it is the attitude that you have to business and your morals and ethics in business that counts, whilst I can say that every member of this board is fantastic and would never judge someone like myself for being straight, some other people within the industry do.
It's a fact of life I guess that some people discriminate against others for many reasons but I say ethical moral behaviour is the way to go in order to earn a great reputation.
Cheers,
Allan
Hey Derek,Quote:
Originally posted by Content Guy Derek
Do you have less respect for a straight person if they work within the gay internet community?
Thank you for being so open about your question. Please know that as the Gay Site Marketing Representative of TopBucks, I have been working closely with straight and gay webmasters for some time now. I encourage straight webmasters all the time to do gay site promotions. I know that there are even several other straight webmasters here who can tell you that promoting gay sites is a great little way to tap into some extra money. Kudos to you dude, for stepping out of the norm and doing something different.
You know i would LOVE for this question to be asked on a primarily straight message board such as PJ's or GFY:
'Im Gay But Work For A Company That Has Straight Content'
You can just imagine the difference in responses to the thread.
Im so glad we have such a diverse and friendly group of community members here :thumbsup:
Regards,
Lee
this is why I wondered why the question was being asked in the first place, because it implies assumed predjustice if the roles were reversed.Quote:
Originally posted by Lee
You know i would LOVE for this question to be asked on a primarily straight message board such as PJ's or GFY:
'Im Gay But Work For A Company That Has Straight Content'
You can just imagine the difference in responses to the thread.
Im so glad we have such a diverse and friendly group of community members here :thumbsup:
Regards,
Lee
Didn't mean to come down on you Derek, as I'm sure you meant nothing at all by your question but to post an interesting subject, but it just reminded me of people who when introduced to a (insert minority) person they reply with "I have a lot of (insert minority) friends"
I would tend to have more respect for you, I used to work exclusively with straight content and I feel your pain, bro!
cheers,
Luke
Some AWESOME AWESOME replies. I dont even know where to start.
Gary-Alan
I was hoping to hear somehting like that.Quote:
GWW is made up of a diverse group (gay, bi, transgender, straight, etc) who are here to do business. And I think I can say in large part a person doing business is respected on how well they do their job not who they sleep with.
Graphicsbytia the question came up because we are are not carring any straight plug ins anymore and I famillair with the gay market and I have read Lee's articles and I was just wodnering if im behind the 8 ball not being gay in gay market.
Dzinerbear. I understand your fustration and it's true what your saying. SO true So very true!
Lee thanks for having me. I really like the high caliber of replies.
Harlan that was a kick ass response one of the best i have read from any message board in a long time. The line it's what you do and how you do, not who you do, that earns respect is classic.
TopBucks_Juan. Im familar withyour posistion at topbucks and we have done biz for the past three years. I looking for your email address and would love to contact you for I have seen you at shows but never got a chance to hang out.
Lee why dont you ask that question?
You know i would LOVE for this question to be asked on a primarily straight message board such as PJ's or GFY
Graphicsbytia the reason I asked this question was I was prepared to not taken seriosly and or joked about behind peoples back.
Chilihost- I wouldn't call it pain per say it's just different
Im tottaly blown away by the replies. Thanks Again.
any jokes would be from pure jealousy, and not to be taken to heart. I post a lot on GFY and this is what I see behind all the haters posts. Jealousy and fear can eat a person's heart out, but if you see it for what it is, you can feel sorry for them instead.Quote:
Originally posted by Content Guy Derek
Lee why dont you ask that question?
You know i would LOVE for this question to be asked on a primarily straight message board such as PJ's or GFY
Graphicsbytia the reason I asked this question was I was prepared to not taken seriosly and or joked about behind peoples back.
I agree with you. This is actually a pet peeve of mine in ANY market - not just the gay market. Newbies who don't make the effort to learn how to work the business through experience, trial & error and research of the market before they dive in - folks who just post on a board asking "how do you make money?" so they can copy/reproduce and make $$$ off your years of hard work.Quote:
Originally posted by Dzinerbear
What is bothering me, however, is the recently spat of straight webmasters popping in here with questions like: what's the best selling gay niche or who are highest converting sponsors? It reminds me of people popping into the search engine board and asking: How do I get a top ten ranking in Google?
I'm all for educating newbies - the folks who want to LEARN. However, I'm NOT for giving newbies the keys to success that others have worked hard to EARN. A few tips, some industry resource links, a point in the right direction, maybe a little critique of their site... but after that, nada. I'm not a newbie hater - I'm an industry supporter and community member. You've gotta respect the work that everyone else has done, learn the biz and then make it your own.
;)
(whew.... somebody stop me from getting on that soapbox the next time!)
Oh... and welcome to the board Derek - you picked a great place to post! Straight... gay... whatever... None of that matters because GWW is one of those rare boards that is just filled with friendly, supportive, hard-working webmasters!
Hope to see you keep posting! :groovy:
I am starting to agree with you on that Kath. I've always helped newbies as much as possible,in public and in private. I like making a difference in people's lives, it's one of the things that drives me. It's rewarding most times, but sometimes, I just end up thowing my hands up in the air. I doubt if I'll ever stop doing it, it's kind of set into my nature. It's true that learning something on your own is much better than having it given to you on a silver platter. I'm a good example of that. Buzzard always told me how to fix things on my computer and keep it running well. Since he died, I've had to do it on my own, and boy.. is it hard, but I'm learning ;)Quote:
Originally posted by Kath
I agree with you. This is actually a pet peeve of mine in ANY market - not just the gay market. Newbies who don't make the effort to learn how to work the business through experience, trial & error and research of the market before they dive in - folks who just post on a board asking "how do you make money?" so they can copy/reproduce and make $$$ off your years of hard work.
I'm all for educating newbies - the folks who want to LEARN. However, I'm NOT for giving newbies the keys to success that others have worked hard to EARN. A few tips, some industry resource links, a point in the right direction, maybe a little critique of their site... but after that, nada. I'm not a newbie hater - I'm an industry supporter and community member. You've gotta respect the work that everyone else has done, learn the biz and then make it your own.
;)
(whew.... somebody stop me from getting on that soapbox the next time!)
Oh... and welcome to the board Derek - you picked a great place to post! Straight... gay... whatever... None of that matters because GWW is one of those rare boards that is just filled with friendly, supportive, hard-working webmasters!
Hope to see you keep posting! :groovy:
anal sex for the first time is a pain....oh you are saying you are NOT going to do this research, LOL!!!Quote:
Originally posted by Content Guy Derek
Chilihost- I wouldn't call it pain per say it's just different
cheers,
Luke
Luke -- you're just plain bad!!Quote:
Originally posted by Chilihost
anal sex for the first time is a pain....oh you are saying you are NOT going to do this research, LOL!!!
cheers,
Luke
... taking side bets on how long it takes us to corrupt Derek :fracais:
Haha trust me Bec Derek is ALREADY corrupted lol
You should see some of the stuff he gets up to at the shows lol
Love ya Derek ;)
Regards,
Lee
Welcome Content Guy Derek.... you will enjoy it here I know I do...
3 days.....Quote:
Originally posted by LdyLnWolf1
Luke -- you're just plain bad!!
... taking side bets on how long it takes us to corrupt Derek :fracais:
Actually... even though Derek avoided me like the plague in Phoenix (private joke - lol)... I would have to say that I'm more worried that he will be a bad influence on Lee than the other way around.Quote:
Originally posted by Lee
Haha trust me Bec Derek is ALREADY corrupted lol
You should see some of the stuff he gets up to at the shows lol
Love ya Derek ;)
Regards,
Lee
And anyone who knows Lee knows... that could be a scary thing! ;)
*ducking and running from both Lee AND Derek* :bow:
thanks for the vote of confidence!Quote:
Originally posted by HeatherF
3 days.....
cheers,
Luke
KATH!!!
Holy fuckign shit!! How the hell are you? Dont even start with me avoiding you. I have tried to meet up with you for the past three years and you saw me and didn't say a thing. Grrrrrrrr!
I agree with you Kath however I consider myself a newbie and I dont mind helping anyone if they did thier homework.
Tia i still need to talk to you thanks for the icq today.
I will continue to post here gay or not it's the most informative place to post I have been to.
After reading all of the replies on this thread, it makes me feel good that I have joined this forum. There seems to be a lot of GREAT people here! I'm going to learn a lot!
TonyK
That was a good thread to read. Firstly, How are ya Derek? Nice to see you here too and I hope to be able to grab some food with you at a show again soon.
Secondly, I just want to expand on what Kath and Dzinerbear were saying. Yes I think there are people trying to go into gay and asking "what works?" but that's ANY category. I myself have done it and picked Darren Austin's brain last year at the Toronto webmaster summit, asking hims some questions about the look and feel of a site. I didn't want to know "Which sponsor converts best?" or anything like that, just some guidelines and that's what I got and I went with it. I feel it's important to be respectful as you both have said of the other person when asking them questions. I don't want the secret to their success, but I'd like some information.
Hmmm... soapbox time huh? :) anyways, I'm still testing my stuff in the gay market, seeing what's working for me.
On a side note, to any other straighties working on this side. What do you find harder to judge, overall look of a site/page or the content? Myself it seems to be more the look of the site/page.
Hey everyone :)
Im new to the board, but have been lurking for awhile. This thread has been really cool to read through and I have a good idea of why Derek asked this question.
I'm sure a lot of you remember some old threads a few months back on the Ynot board that brought this whole issue or question...
The problems I have with webmasters are universal... and no matter what they are promoting or what gender/preferences/lifestyles they choose doesn't affect those things in the least...
Derek when did your Co drop the babes :bow: ?
Hey Derek - we have spoken at length before and nice to see you come out of the closet here at GWW!!Quote:
Originally posted by Content Guy Derek
Do you have less respect for a straight person if they work within the gay internet community?
;)
Seriously, with a name like "Lindsay" people think I'm a girl as often as not.
With a nick like "ToyBoy" people think I'm gay.
Actually, I'm a lesbian stuck in the body of this big bald ugly bastard!!!!
IMHO, it's all about judgements, and I judge people as people, sexuality is irrelevant.
I used to say often that I am not racist, sexist, homophobic, heterophobic or anti-semetic.
I HATE EVERYONE EQUALLY.
Jokes of course.
I think the actor Kevin Spacey summed it up best:
I am not heterosexual, homosexual or bisexual, I am just sexual.
:bandana: