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Don't know if most of you have only one niche that you build or run banners of, but I have four at this point... Don't know how wise that is, but I'm trying to figure out which ones do best.... so far I've noticed that TWINKS are absolutely the worst converting thing I have... to put it blantly, they don't convert at all... while Black and Voyeur do me good....
My worst is gay hentai
I can't sell twinks.
I can't sell twinks either.
dzinerbear
These days I'm haveing a hard time selling anything...lol
I do ok with ebony and with the working men movies (for the traffic I've sent)
The one Voyeur site I promote has really, really sucked big time...may be time to move on from that sponsor.
Again a vote for twinks.
I just think the surfer has been bombarded by so many twink sites that all have the same emactiated looking guys on them that they know unless a site is offering a micro niche in the twink niche that they really arent worth joining.
Then you have those so-called twink 'mega sites' to which promise everything under the sun which, because the site owners business model has been the same for the last 5+ years means that the vast majority of the content has been seen before.
I do beleive that we will however, see a much wider range of niches within the gay market this coming year which can only help promoters of gay sites in the long run and, whilst i would say that there will always be a demand for twinks by the surfers, i also think that catering to the tastes of the 'non-twink' market is honestly where the real money lays.
Regards,
Lee
Greetings:
Ok, I'm going to take a risk and out myself here:Quote:
Originally posted by Rainbo1956
and with the working men movies
Am I the ONLY person that visits this board that thinks most of the guys on the "working men" movies site look, well, homeless...
:err:
Surely I can't be the only one that doesn't understand why people find the homeless look appealing?
I think I'm a minority within a minority, what a bitch, haha.
Twinks and Jocks... the worst. I send very little traffic to sites like Randy Blue, but with the results so far, I don't need to expend too much more energy in that direction.
As far as WorkinMenMovies, yes some of them do look homeless ... some of them are ;). But the site appeals to guys that are looking for REAL men... not pretty boys.
And JustMe, you are in the majority, not the minority! It's just that a few of us on here have been very vocal about WMM because it is exactly what we have been looking for to send our traffic.
twink only sells for me when the site has fresh-faced boys between 18-22. most twink sites have pics that don't look fresh and clean. i don't know how old the average models actually are, but i've seen balding "twinks" on tours, twinks with 2 days of beard growth, muscular "jock" types... jeez!
Well just to clear something... I started this thread because on another board which is mostly straight oriented they had the same question and the worst converting niche was "Teens"...
so I wanted to know if gay market has same "problems"... As someone said, obviously there's been too much twink sites in last few years and it just got a bit "dull"....
P.s. Maybe I'm doing bad with it because I really don't have any idea which twink faces have featured gazillions of times and which not... as it's really not my primary choice... Guess I'll drop them
You know the easiest way to find that out is to take a look at some of the larger sponsors 'twink' paysites, topbucks, silvercash, platinumbucks, python etc etcQuote:
Originally posted by dalimili
P.s. Maybe I'm doing bad with it because I really don't have any idea which twink faces have featured gazillions of times and which not... as it's really not my primary choice... Guess I'll drop them
Take a look at just how many of them use the same models and the same pics within a set and base your choices on that.
You may be better off going to some of the smaller but upcoming sponsors and promoting their twink sites such as Pride Bucks.
Thats not to say there isnt a place for the larger sponsors twink sites such as TopBucks and the others i mentioned earlier but if you see a site with the same model being used over and over again, the chances are, the surfer has already seen it and, potentially already joined and cancelled their membership to that site.
Regards,
Lee
justme,
I understand your point, but I'm taking it that you aren't really into bearded, older, hairy guys, so why would you find those guys attractive. I'm not attracted to younger guys unless their Czech or Hungarian, slightly muscled, and uncut. And a lot of the younger guys/twinks that I see other other sites are skinny, scrawny, hairyless, unappealing, and really just a step away from emaciated. I don't get why there is so much of that on the Net.
So now imagine that you're a guy like me and you stumble across a site like Workin Men Movies, of course you're going to buy a membership. I have sold more memberships for WMM in one month than I have for Randy Blue in a whole year. And I actually like the guys on Randy Blue, and to clarify I don't think they're the emaciated type I was talking about up top, they're more muscled, jockish, but still there's so much of that type of guy out there, it's harder to sell.
Cheers
Dzinerbear
I completly agree with Dzinerbear,
I have sold more WMM memberships than some other "main" niches within the gay market.
I don't find the guys from WMM appealing but at the end what counts is what my traffic likes.
Honestly, I will sell almost anything that has a price tag attached. I don't have to like the content to sell it. If it's something my traffic likes, so be it.
Because I like money in my pocket more then I care if I like the content or not. Maybe that's just me.
Now that i'm totally off subject, the hardest selling niche for me was the manly muscle men. latin content I did GREAT with, but the big str8 jock stuff I couldn't move much.
I can't not sell twinks.
Seriously, I put up a new twink sponsor and am bombarded with sales.
Same with college guys.
Because the site I have has that kind of traffic. The free content I put up is twink/college guy. So that's the flavor the surfers are in to, that's what the bookmarked surfers are lookin' to see. That's what people who share the site with friends and on boards are sharing it for.
On no link lists have I put myself in to the Twinks category. But it's still what the majority of content is and so what people go for.
I can't sell bears on this site. I can't sell guys over 30 on this site. But twinks and college guys go like hotcakes.
I don't think the twink niche is tired. I don't think it's burnt out or lost its luster.
I think there are some fantastic, amazingly well converting, excellently run, and extremely great twink sites out there. So rather than the entire niche being tired, perhaps a lot of people just aren't promoting the right sponsors or haven't built a traffic base inclined to be interested in twink sites.
BD hit it dead on... just as he always does. It all comes down to how you generate your traffic.
I don't sell young men/twinks well because my traffic is coming from hairy/mature/leather men sites. And the surfers that are on my sites are most likely not interested in twinks.
Dalimili, may I suggest that you limit your approach to what interests you. If you absolutely love scawny white boys with caved in chests or grotesquely obese black men with dreadlocks, that is what you are going to be the most successful at marketing... at least to start. Once you become the master of your niche, then it's time to expand into other areas.
andymike - just goes to show everyone has different results. my best selling niche of all time is muscle men. in fact, i'm making my first paysite with no outside partners in this niche, and i'm taking my time as my muscle avs site continues to sell.
BDBionic - funny thing, bears is another very strong seller for me. i guess i'm pickier about twink sites content 'cause i like guys and girls who are long, smooth, slender.
If you get the high quality stuff on there, it's hard for it to not convert.
Frankly there are indeed a lot of shitty twink sites out there, just as there are a great many shitty sites of all niches.
No offense to a lot of the bigger program sponsors but when I check out their "twink" tours I rarely if ever see an actual twink.
It's important for anyone promoting any niche sponsor to have an awareness about that content themselves. You can spot slender, gorgeous young men and stick to that with your sponsors. I know what twink-loving surfers want because I have a fondness for twinks myself. Other people here on GWW do great with bear sponsors because they have a great eye for bears and know what sells by knowing what turns them on. That's what is so key.
When promoting a supposed and self professed twink sponsor without any real twinks in the tour or just a couple actual twinks - the rest being more college guy or jock types or flat out old - you'll breed hostility and contempt more than sales. Just because a guy is under 25 doesn't mean he's a twink. Just because he's got no chest hair doesn't mean he's a twink. Just because he's blond doesn't mean he's a twink. But so many people seem to think it does and then wonder why they can't sell 28 year old guy "twink" sites.
If you want to sell twinks, go with programs run by the people actually creating the content. Mom and pop operations. Webmaster-owned sites with affiliate programs. Exclusive and original content.
http://www.boyfunk.com
http://www.bfcollection.com
http://www.doggyboys.com
http://www.truetwinks.com
are a few I think everyone should take a peek at. Then you got your college boy sites that often have twinks in the mix as well. Consistently young, fresh, exclusive guys, they're able to branch away from the stereotypical twink-type models and have guys a wee bit older and more built because they still have high quality, exclusive, original content with gorgeous young men.
http://www.corbinfisher.com
http://www.belamionline.com
http://www.randyblue.com
http://www.teenboymodels.com
There's no way in hell the twink niche will ever get tired. It's definitely the case that, knowing it's so popular, a shitload of programs will come out with a shitload of sites attempting to pursue twink sales that are crappy, untrue to form, non-converting and unsellable. But it doesn't mean twinks don't sell. It means those sites don't sell. Gay people will never get sick of twinks, and so long as someone out there is making some high quality stuff on a high quality website backed by a high quality affiliate program, it'll convert like wildfire when webmasters send quality traffic to it.
Oh I know everyone has different results, but I also know that you must know what your traffic is looking for. If it's twinks, sell twinks, if it's bareback, sell bareback.
People don't pay attention to their traffic and aren't maximizing on the results that could come from it. I would bet that it happens mostly because they aren't turned on by the niche.
Quote:
Originally posted by basschick
andymike - just goes to show everyone has different results. my best selling niche of all time is muscle men. in fact, i'm making my first paysite with no outside partners in this niche, and i'm taking my time as my muscle avs site continues to sell.
well, I'm biased as heck because at the moment, two of the three sites we run are about as twinky as it gets, but here goes.
-- With the right traffic, we have amazing conversions for boyfunk.com. A lot of our sponsors that have good twink traffic regularly convert at 1:75; other sponsors with mixed traffic still convert at between 1:125 and 1:250.
-- I do strongly believe that if you're pushing a twink site, it needs to *be* a twink site. I can't tell you how many "Barely 18" 35 year olds there are on supposedly twink sites.
Not that there isn't a market for 35 year olds; I'm guessing that Pridebucks new "menover30.com" is converting very well... it's just that surfers get annoyed and actively pissed off when they go to a twink site expecting cute 18-22 year olds and get 35 year olds.
-- I also support the notion that, as most of us here probably already know, the gay surfer is a different animal than the straight surfer. From my experience, the buyer of gay porn is more discriminating in what he wants, and more demanding... but if he gets what he wants and gets decent service, he also tends to stay around longer than his straight counterpart.
-- As for the original question of niches that convert poorly, I haven't tried enough to have much input yet. I can tell you that our twink sites do very well for us, and our twink feet site (boysfeetclub) also seems to do extremely well. Later this year, we'll be launching a site for slightly more, um, mature guys (as in 21-25) that are well built but still very cute. It will be interesting to see how that site does relative to our twinkier sites.
There have been many excellent points made and the addendeum I would like to make to BDBionic's point on how you are generating your traffic is what to do with it once you have it.
Banners that get clicked on because they are hot and enticing but not representative of what the surfer will find when he gets to the tour page are a waste of bandwidth.
Steamy juicy text links are a great alternative to the often banner-blind more seasoned surfer, but if the links says "Click here for the free videos" it's like a cyber lottery to see if the surfer will be taken to a site that will have what he's looking for. "click here for boys fucking" won't generate many sales to a site that has mostly solos nor will "Watch the muscle jocks jacking" do you much good on a twink site.
TGP galleries...well, Free Hosted Galleries are very convenient but quickly get posted and unless you are lucky enough to be one of the first, probably won't get listed in many places. Galleries you make yourself are usually a better solution but not if you put twink pictures for a gallery that links to a ebony site or use bear pics to sell an asian site.
The more accurately your techniques promote the best points of the site you
are trying to sell, the happier you will be with the results. Sponsors that
offer a well stocked arsenal of banners, links and free content will be a
great help in making that a reality.
Which niches convert best is three a three-pronged approach based on asking yourself three questions IMHO:
1) where is my traffic coming from and which type of sites are they
most likely to be interested in
2) what tools should I use to promote the best features of the site
I am sending them off to.
3) how good is the site's tour to close the deal once I get the
traffic there?
This is a great topic with some great posts. We have mainly all twink sites now but in several different niches like twink cum sites, striaight boy twinks, twink feet etc. They all do very well for us. Our twink sites are what has kept us afloat. We have some semi exclusive content but not enough. This year we plan on doing our own content which I think will help alot. I love twinks so I think that helps alot when doing twinks sites, though I am jealous of some other twink sites on here that have unbelievebly hot twinks. We actually just dropped all our straight sites but 1 of them a couple days ago so IntenseCash is mainly going to be a gay program now, yippiee!
Mark
mark - i can't wait till you have more promo content for the foot site!
I am working on that, we will have some soon. :)Quote:
Originally posted by basschick
mark - i can't wait till you have more promo content for the foot site!
Mark
It is hard to say we have so many niches on our site.
Twinks do not convert as well as you would think considering the abundance of twink movies we get.
Right now on the gay side our best converting niche is Interracial and or Black