Need To Make A Remark About "Community"

[abostonboy]

Many think a "community" is a webmaster board. While the board may get the community "together", it is NOT the whole community. The community is those of us that get to know each other, help each other, talk to each other, lend an ear when one is needed, scold one another when the time arises, and just plain be friends and have a good time and some good business together.

Communities survive with or without the boards that helped create them in the first place.

Does anyone agree with me?

[Squirt]

Agreed :thumbsup:

[desslock]

Well I commented over on the other board, and I may as well say it here.

If you invite a diverse group of people over, sometimes they will say things that will rub you, me or the moderators the wrong way. If people start acting like an idiot, and I myself move in and out of varying states of lucidity, it's best for moderators to often just hold their nose.

The resulting impression is that your online community has turned into a tyranny. And then people go elsewhere.

If you do not like the word community, maybe just think of an active message forum as a hive. Hives have all kinds of activity, good / bad / in the middle, but one hive does not represent the entire world of bees.

Steve

[basschick]

i agree with you, lloyd.

and it's just my personal opinion, but i feel that the moderation happening on the other board isn't in the style or feel of the existing and diverse community on that board. of course, that's only my $0.02

[TropixxxStudios]

i agree with you, lloyd.

and it's just my personal opinion, but i feel that the moderation happening on the other board isn't in the style or feel of the existing and diverse community on that board. of course, that's only my $0.02

I could not agree more.

[deanb]

I agree with you guys as well, that other board and the events of the last week really turned me off to it, the way the situation was handled, then the fiasco with Chip really kinda ruined that board IMO.

[Mansized]

I cannot believe I'm actually posting in this thread, because I try to avoid the "board dramas" as much as possible.

Yeah..everyone has a gripe about one board or another, about a moderator, a member, a thread, whatever. It comes and goes like a roller coaster on the net.

The "other" board (I love it..I guess there are only 2 gay boards on the net! grin) DOES have a strange way at times of handling things. But, it is their board, and if people don't like it, they just stop going to the board. That's why I'm not worried about it.

And while I'm throwing my own bricks at "the other board" because of some poor moderation tactics/techniques they have been using, I have to also say that there are times I wonder why someone pretty influential on THIS board seems to enjoy baiting the heck out of the moderators on the other board, which results in some of the dust ups that have taken place there.

BEFORE ya'll get down my throat that I have used "baiting" to accuse someone of, it's MY opinion, right or wrong, and like I said at the top of this post, this is why I don't like to get into these types of threads.

It will sort itself out eventually..it always does.

[gaystoryman]

For myself, I look at a board, forum, more like the local community hall in a small town, where people gather, gossip, discuss the latest weather, and do some business. As Lloyd says, it isn't the whole of the community itself, merely a convenient gathering place.

As to the other board, well for myself it isn't the moderation of it, or lack of it, or whatever. It is how it has allowed a climate of fear to permeate my own thinking, when seeing a post, and wondering about replying.

It also transcends that locale as well, it inhibits one's conscious thought about posting at other boards, for fear of retribution.

my pennies worth, I guess.

[gaybucks_chip]

Perhaps, as one of the people repeatedly speaking for a reasonable tone of moderation at GMS, my comments could have been interpreted as "baiting", but the honest truth was, they were never intended that way.

I kept asking, begging, even, for the owner and moderator to appropriately moderate the board so the signal-to-noise level is reasonable and a modicum of courtesy and respect could be found there. Or at least, to give some guidance as to what the moderation policy actually was. Finally, JP came out and said, in so many words, "I like drama and bickering threads, there's nothing wrong with them, I have no intention of discouraging them, so fuck off."

As he was the designated moderator of the board, I accepted his policy statement at face value and stopped complaining about moderation policy.

But then, a few days later, Mark posted a thread and asked if GMS should be "censored." Poor choice of words, as no one would vote for censorship, particularly in this industry. But nonetheless, three or four of us answered the thread, and pretty much everyone said "no censorship" and "better moderation". A couple of people said they felt they had to be careful posting for fear the "moderator" would rip them a new one. I pointed to a community that has a major problem with people going off the deep end, and a very sensible way that they've found to manage the community and minimize inappropriate behavior.

Magically, that thread disappeared, almost certainly because it was not flattering to JP, though there were no "flames" in it, just honest comments.

I posted another thread asking why the first one had been deleted, and pointing out that when the leaders of a community seek input and then remove the thread when it doesn't go their way, it damages the community's confidence in the transparency of the policy setting process, and, in fact, undermines the entire sense of community.

That thread, too, was deleted, along with Forbidden Red's thread in which he'd asked about other gay webmaster communities. I and maybe one or two others had answered Forbidden Red's thread and included information about three other boards (including this one), what I knew about them, and the differences between them.

After those threads were deleted, I posted one more thread, pointing out that the constant deleting of threads with no explanation, no discussion, and no communication to the community was not in the best interests of fostering a sense of trust in that community.

That thread got me banned from GMS, and yielded an appallingly tacky and unprofessional posting from JP (now also deleted) publicly speaking about my banning, accusing me of having started 5 threads (there were 2) about the censorship, and using words such as "blubbercunt."

As I said in an earlier thread a few weeks ago, I am just thankful that this (GWW) community has matured to the point where the posters here generally don't see any need to act out the way JP and a handful of the posters at GMS do, and the moderators have learned a low-key and "hands off" way of working with people who step over the line.

I just hope Mark would actually take action before JP completely ruins that community (if he hasn't already.) But so far (and it's been over 48 hours now), he will neither answer my emails or respond to my ICQs, even though he is actively posting at GMS, so it's clear it's intentional.

Very, very sad.

[gaybucks_chip]

One other thing I should make clear:

Mark has every right to run his board whatever way he sees fit. I'm not trying to suggest otherwise. The only thing that would be useful is a statement of policy so that posters know what is and is not appropriate. "The moderator can be completely arbitrary, is allowed to offend and insult other posters and do whatever he wants, consistent or not" would probably suffice for the current policy. At least then, people would know when they're signing up what they're getting into.

[Squirt]

I just hope Mark would actually take action before JP completely ruins that community (if he hasn't already.)

Well according to the post JP made on that board this morning, he and Mark are the same person :boring: Thanks "you know who" for the ICQ and screen capture :thumbsup:

So JP or Mark, or whoever he is, seems to be going through a melt down. It will pass. Whether you choose to let it affect you is up to you. Being banned from that board will not affect your business or your social life :bunny:

It's a shame JP is going through tough times. When I spoke to him on the phone way back when he seemed a real nice guy that had it together.

[gaybucks_chip]

I totally realize (and realized quite a while ago) that GMS isn't a place to get business done, so being banned there isn't any heartbreak for me. Actually, the majority of my posts were "helpful" things like answers to technical questions and such rather than creating business opportunities, so I don't see any personal or professional loss from not posting there.

JP is so proud of his precious sense of humor. More power to him.

[basschick]

it's been odd for me not to go to gms for the past couple days, but for a long time now, it's been more like 2 communities existing - sometimes uneasily - in one location, and JP is an odd third influence there that doesn't feel like he fits in with either and is now forcing both sides of the community to change to fit his personality. i've never seen such heavy-handed moderation - if it even is moderation, because the moderation seemed more like a combination of gfy meanness and random flames on people.

it IS mark's board and he absolutely has the right to make whatever choices regarding it that he sees fit. i wish him luck and i'm sure i'll go back to say hi to everyone sometime but i don't want to be called a whiner and insulted on a personal level just because jp doesn't agree with me preferring business posts, and i didn't like seeing it done to chip.

[abostonboy]

If you invite a diverse group of people over, sometimes they will say things that will rub you, me or the moderators the wrong way. If people start acting like an idiot, and I myself move in and out of varying states of lucidity, it's best for moderators to often just hold their nose.

Actually Adam replied to your post about that and tried to say that it was a bad analogy. When I started to reply to it, the whole thread got deleted.

It's almost like a party. Sometimes a certain group of people will get drunk and act like total maniacs and all the "fun" people will leave. If you don't do anything as the host of the party, you are left with a bunch of drunk maniacs. On the other hand, if you kindly ask the "maniacs" to leave, you have a good party that can be fun the whole night long. When I throw a party, I don't "hold my nose".

[abostonboy]

I didn't create this thread to cause any board drama. It is just many webmasters felt that they lost their community. Communities exist without boards and can still be strong. That's all I wa trying to point out.

Seriously though, I TRULY believe that it moderation out of fear over there. And I use the term moderation for lack of a better word. Besides it being one of the most highly censored boards, webmasters are afraid to post. I for one am real tired of being called a blubbercunt or making someones blubbercunt itch and when I start to reply to the thread it gets deleted.