Need Advice: Site Not Converting

[JustMe]

Greetings All:

http://www.BoyAlley.com/

Ok, I am in need of some serious industry related advice here. I'm not exactly sure where we're going wrong.

We've started to do some test runs with our PaySite to get an idea of how our current tour converts, and simply put, it doesn't.

I'm going to start listing thoughts in a random and unorganized manner, but that's the scary way my mind works. Any advice from the pro's would be much appreciated

1. No full frontal. I know this may be a factor, but I have to play nice by my attorney. As a gay man, the images that are up look as provocative as you can get without showing all the goods. I also know there are a lot of other very successful sites not showing it all, so I'm unsure how big of a factor this is.

2. Yes, there are models in the tour from sites like maxpixels, so it's not 100% exclusive content. But, there is some exclusive and a LOT of semi-exclusive stuff mixed in there too, so I don't know here either. Most of the stuff in the tour is far from being what I would consider "over exposed". Surely I don't need 100% exclusive to launch?

3. Check-out, we're using CCBill for mastercard, discover, jcb and a different processor for visa/amex, along with a european processor. This is temp while we look into getting our own mercantile account, and I really don't think it would significantly effect conversion?

4. Traffic sources. Ok, I haven't thrown a TON of traffic to it yet, mainly because I want to be sure we have the tour in a converting format before I do. We've thrown traffic from MenOnTheNet, Google, TGPs, ManCheck, and UGAS at it. So far have made like, ooooh, 7 sales?!?! I'm not even positive what this makes the conversion ratio, but it's not pretty!

5. The paysite area is actually pretty damn decent for a newly launched site. Several tens of thousands of images, about 1,000 videos that can be downloaded or streamed, exclusive and semi-exclusive content, and a cool live sex show to boot. However, I KNOW this isn't effecting sales, since we haven't made enough for anyone to know wtf's on the inside of the site, haha.

6. Maybe I'm being too optimistic of how well a newly launched site should convert? I really don't see time live as a big factor here. I would think most subscriptions to paysites are impulse buys, and not the result of a week or so of contemplation.

7. I think the tour looks professional, without looking cookie-cutter. At least, that was our goal. We want people to know it wasn't just thrown together by a couple of halfwits in 15 minutes, and at the same time not have them think that we just went out and dropped 500 on a pre-fab design. I'm not sure.

We're planning on hiring a consultant to help with marketing, but I'd rather have something live and running that half converts before we do. We've already paid one man about 1k to look everything over (not going to mention any names), and we implemented all of his advice, but the thing still doesn't convert.

I'm hoping to have the problems, whatever they may be, worked out before we bring another consultant on board.

Something's off color, I'm just not sure what. I'm hoping I can figure out if it's the tour or my traffic sources (or something else?) that's the culprit.

[JustMe]

Greetings:

Oh, one last thing. We've started to move our Webmaster's Resource section online too. So far, we have up part of our online tool box which includes:

1. Website Statistics: lookup total inlinks, google pagerank, etc.
2. Keyword Ranking: see how a site shows up using different keywords
3. Spider View: look for link errors, view site structure, etc.
4. Find Dying Domains: look for expired domains in dmoz, etc.

Very much under construction, but since some of you might happen past it anyway, I thought I'd mention it here.

No need to register, no banner ads, nothing like that. Just our way of saying "thanks", located at:
http://www.boyalley.com/webmasters/

[gaystoryman]

Nice, but to me, and please keep in mind that I am weird and not normal but your whole tour is too busy and comes across like I am in a board room meeting not strolling down a back alley looking for a hot steamy sex romp.

There is no 'personality' to the tour as far as I feel. I think sites need to engage the surfer and drag him in by making him want to come in... no frontal nudity to me isn't an issue, its how you display and word the come on's that will or won't get the surfer clicking further.

Also again it is all images. SE need actual text, good anchor text links, H1 and Title tags..

Anyhow, just my warped view so take it with a grain of salt.

hth
Ian

[Squirt]

I'm sorry to hear your hitting some snags. You are determind and talented so I'm sure you wont have this problem long.

Let me share some of my experience in the six years I've been doing this online.

In sales there are two factors relating to your success in closing a deal. 1) A qualified sales lead ( your surfer ) 2) Kick ass presentation of your product or service ( your site design and tour ).

People will give you all sorts of advice on how to create a money making tour, I suggest you goto the sites that are making a ton of money and see what their tours are like.

What your site is lacking, that they aren't, is a transparent tour. A trasparent tour is a tour that shows what your site looks like inside with access to content etc. disabled of course :-D Goto Sean Cody, Randy Blue, Amateur straight Guys, Hard n straight, etc. and see how they do it. Don't copy them, but learn from their framework. Oddly enough your Boyalley.net site is more similar to a transparent tour then the boyalley.com site.

It sounds like the traffic side isn't so much of an issue yet as MenOnTheNet is a good traffic source and should bring a hot new site with cute guys like your sales right away. But traffic is king and after you get even marginal sales you need to look at who's coming to your site and make sure they are qualified surfers. (TIP: One of the best ways to do this is get affiliates that put your banner on the inside of their members area ;-D ) you can't get surfers more qualified then that.

I love your tour, I think it's well thought out, different and has it's own sense of style. On the other hand it lacks a connection with the guys ( no short stories about them, the shoot, etc. ), doesn't project the depth of content you have in the site, and is similar to some rip off sites that show a bunch of hot guys and only have minimal content inside.

These days, as the surfer gets smarter and ripped off more often, it's important to show them on the outside EXACTLY what they'll get on the inside. And G rated works as well as X rated IMO.

Sorry to be so long winded. I hope this helps.

[basschick]

i don't love this page http://www.boyalley.com and i wouldn't bother to market it.

the boys aren't boyish looking. they're not fresh, young cuties like some of the maxpixels guys. the page feels like it has no layout - it's a collage of pics with a box of text. and this page http://www.boyalley.com/index2.php doesn't seem to have an overall layout.

the text in the boxes is very generic, including the join page. you could say all that about any site in any niche by changing the word twink.

why not make a page layout that focuses on the boys at their cutest and youngest, and text that talks about them? barely legal teen boys, 18 year old boys, college boys sucking cock in the frat house - where's the sex? where's the keywords to tempt those of us who love a cute 18 year old? almost every site has thousands of pics, hundreds of videos, live chat. but what you are selling the surfers on - imo - is that you have CUTE BARELY LEGAL BOYS.

text helps a lot - you have exclusive never-before-seen college boys. 18 year old guys who are tasting their first cocks. the boy next door. tell us about it!

pics? don't throw them all together on a collage - show the really good pics of the hottest 18 and 19 year olds, and let each one stand out a little. and if you have 1 or 2 big ones per page, let them be the ones that you think are as hot as an 18 year old can get. show us the cutest ones.

this is only my opinion, but instead of trying to tell and show the surfer everything you have, show him your best in words that will make him want to see it all!

[Lee]

Okay without having read the rest of the replies in this thread as yet here are a couple of things i would suggest in order to make the site more sellable..

Index.php page:

This is the first page that your surfers are going to see and, for all intents and purposes, it is a wasted page, there is nothing on the page that draws my attention to the fact that this site features fresh-faced twinks at all.

Apart from the page lacking in the 'wow factor' the 'join now' link is also far to small IMHO that should be the biggest link on the page and animated as it is now instead, the largest link is for the 'members' area.

The pics themselves on this page are good quality however, they do look as if they have just been 'thrown' on the page to fill the space up. Because of this, non of them really stand out over any of the others, again, IMHO, every page on a tour should have 3 main parts to it as far as images go, a focal point - largest pic on the page, a tertiary image/s - the next largest images and, the background 'filler' images.

Index2.php page:

The page when first loaded show 'loading..' to me that is a waste of marketing time, for the most part, the first 3 seconds on any given page is the amount of time you have to make the surfer become interested in your site, whether you are selling porn members or books, if the first thing a surfer sees is some standard text, you have lost them IMHO.

That being said, this page does at least have somewhat of a structure so far as the images being used themselves, in fact my attention was immediately drawn to the guy on the left with a pierced eyebrow

My only main concern on this second page is that the text seems a little to 'formal' that is to say it is blocked out at the bottom left of the page, again, general maketing rules dictate that for the most part, sufers tend to read web pages from top to bottom, left to right, so the text itself, if you want to have it boxed should be at the top most left section of the site or, the bottom right of the tour page.

Again, the text itself doesnt reallt 'do' anything for me, i have seen the same text on thousands of sites in the past. As a surfer i want to know what makes YOUR site different from the countless others out there on the web?

Also, the 'join' link doesnt do the page justice, instead of having it animated orange/grey have it orange/ white, it WILL stand out more

Index3.php page:

The first thing that caught my eye on this page was the flash animation which is very good however, you have nothing else around that area of the page at all, put some text there, even if its something generic suchs as 'twinks fucking'.

Again, the text is boxed and formal looking, spread it out across the page, you have a 300x200 sized space at the top right of the page which for all intents and purposes is dead space, throw some text in there to get the surfer interested.

Also, the join link again doesnt stand out as much as it could / should.

Index4.php page:

Again, as with the first page, the images all appear to be thrown together in order to fill the page, as i mentioned above make sure you have 3 primary types of imagery in use, focal point, tertiary focal point and filler images, as it stands right now, you have filler images and thats it as far as im concerned.

You may also want to change the image of the guy on the left hand side of the page, he doesnt stand out at all and the size of him overall, he should

Its nice to see you have changed the positioning of the text on this page however, again it looks to 'formal' because of how it is blocked, that text should be spread across the entire page and again should be specific to something your site has that no other twink site does.. this is the page where the surfer is going to decide to click to the join page or not and, as a surfer right now, i wouldnt go to the next page.. youll have wasted a potential sale.

Join.php page:

I actually like the layout of this page in general however, the three images you have on the bottom left should be in the upper right of the page and, they should be 3 different images. By giving a surfer a chance to see 3 images from 3 different sets instead of 3 from the same set you are potentially giving them an opportunity to see a model that is going to excite them thus, hopefully making them want to join in order to see more of that model.

Again however, you have boxed text on this page and, unfortunatly it is in the wrong location, you want to make one last sales attempt with this text so move it higher up the page so the surfer sees it without having to scroll down past the join options

Hopefully this info has helped you out and hopefully if you mak even a couple of the changes suggested you'll start to see some sales rolling in

Overall however, the site is good it just lacks 'personality' which is going to make it differ from the countless other twink sites out there. Work on giving the site a life of its own on the tour pages and im positive you will be on to a winner with it :thumbsup:

Regards,

Lee

[Lee]

Originally posted by JustMe
We've already paid one man about 1k to look everything over (not going to mention any names

I would be interested in finding out who this was, if you could find your way to sending me a PM with a name it would be appreciated

It would of course be kept confidential

Regards,

Lee

[Squirt]

Originally posted by Lee
I would be interested in finding out who this was, if you could find your way to sending me a PM with a name it would be appreciated It would of course be kept confidential

Why do you even care Lee? :high:

[Lee]

Originally posted by Squirt
Why do you even care Lee? :high:

Because this isnt the first instance of me hearing about someone doing 'marketing' work that has gone bad.

I want to make sure that someone isnt using GWW as a tool to scam people

Regards,

Lee

[Squirt]

Originally posted by Lee
Because this isnt the first instance of me hearing about someone doing 'marketing' work that has gone bad.

I want to make sure that someone isnt using GWW as a tool to scam people

Noble intentions. That's cool Lee. Probably some straight guy running a turnkey "Gay niche" site ripping our family members off :-D

[Squirt]

But of course you'll keep it private so we'll never know and others will still fall victim :-D

You should have a "rip off" forum for all the bad experences some have online, to warn others.

[Matt 26z]

[longboardjim]

Aloha boyalley.com! ,
First Off , Congradulations On Opening Your Site! , 2nd Keep In Mind That All Advice Given Here Is Meant To Be "Constructive" And Not "Destructive" And What May Work For "One" Does Not Always Work For "ALL" ( We Love You Britney! , 3rd And Probably The Hardest To Maintain "Personal-Identity" ( Niche ) , With So Many Adult Websites Out There To Choose From "Standing-Out" Is The Way To Go , In Your Case "Alleyboys"
I Looked At Your Site Before I Read Some Of The Posted Comments And Being A Photographer For My Site I Can Only Say Trust The Golden Rule..."A Picture Is Worth A Thousand Words" , You Need More "Alley's" , Young Homeless Boys In Torn Tee's And Tattered Jeans Leaning Against Brick Walls And Dumpsters! ( Models Of Course!Everything About Your Site Should Say "Alley" Even The Text Should Look Like "Graffiti" Sprayed In Neon Colors.
Let's Trade , You Send Me Your Clean-Cut Boys! , And I'll Send You My Homeless Models I Have To Clean-Up!

[Xstr8guy]

It could be that your site is "just another twink site"... how many more twink sites do we need? Maybe if it was 'Bear Alley', I could get excited about it. What are there, maybe a thousand twinks sites out there and a dozen bear sites?

Kinda harsh, I know, but the market is SATURATED with twink sites. If you really want to be successful, do something different.


Another bit of advice... don't use screen captures from videos, unless they are crystal clear. Otherwise potential members will think that the video quality is terrible.

[jonjayw]

Originally posted by JustMe
http://www.BoyAlley.com/ . . . I'm not exactly sure where we're going wrong. We've started to do some test runs with our PaySite to get an idea of how our current tour converts, and simply put, it doesn't.

Possible problem???

1. No full frontal. not a factor IMHO

2. it's not 100% exclusive content. not a factor IMHO

3. [payment processors] not a factor IMHO

4. Traffic sources. if tried and true Gay traffic they'll pass on 'oh, gee, another twink site' -- if newbie traffic they might bite regardless of the what or why of the sell.

5. The paysite area . . . However, I KNOW this isn't effecting sales, since we haven't made enough for anyone to know wtf's on the inside of the site, haha. Tend to agree!! BUT!!! If you get a theme/personality going don't drop it after the tour. Keep it going throughout the site -- with sections like: dark downtown alley, sunny sea shore alley, behind the club alley.

6. . . . time live . . . impulse buying, yes. Big problem is you're not selling anything special with your tour that will kick off that impulse. It's just another twinkie site with no real 'theme' or personality to make it stand out. Why the title?? Why no building of a theme/personality for the site based on the title/url???

7. . . . tour looks professional . . . yep. sure does - - if you're selling twink pics to needy webmasters. Selling membership access to 'more of the same' is redundant to tooooo many other sites already screaming for the twink lover's attention.

. . . We've already paid one man about 1k to look everything over you got took!! -- what were his qualifications in the Gay market?? Do let Lee know who it was (as he asked).

Be bold, be different, be unique . . . with a twink site you must stand out heads above the rest or you're just in the pack, fighting for the same slice of the Gay market.