Accusations vs. Confirmations on the Boards

[TheLegacy]

I remember several years back my niece and I were in an arguement that lasted nearly 6 months. We had missed Christmas's - birthdays and other holidays because of her bitterness towards me and mine to hers.

The person between us was my brother, who kept passing details back and forth - attempting as he said, to bring us back together. One day I had gotten so sick over the anger that I called her up directly to speak as to why she was accusing me of something I hadnt done.

In her own words, she spoke about actions I had taken and my apparent motives. I was shocked in that it was my brother (her dad) who had made these recommendation and guided me based on something that he actually wanted for himself, he used me. I was acting on his words and trusted his perception of the situation. But when it fell apart he blamed me instead of taking it himself and facing his daughters wrath.

My niece and I decided to have a dinner meeting with my brother and together we realized that for months, he was the one who made the mistake and was trying to cover his tracks - to the point of letting her hate me.. so long as he looked good to her and their relationship was fine.

It is now 2004, and once again my niece and I split - looking as though it may take a year to repair. Once again, my brother is in the middle of us - my hope is that he is not repeating his ways.

I see this same misunderstand and angry accusations even now and it saddens me almost to the point of crying.

I have seen this happen way too many times on the boards with people I love. Someone this board get slammed on other boards for not paying bills, calling them a scammer etc. and get harassed each time they post. My experience is that I have met and care deeply for this person and I know that no matter what - I wont betray them on the boards, figuring that they must have a reason for whatever decision they made.

I remember the story of the king who forgave a poor man over 100,000$ by not throwing him in jail for life. yet after the king forgave him, the poor man walked out of the palace, and bumped into someone who owed him 100$ - he demanded the money, and was going to throw him in jail, when the king heard of this - he became angry and called the poor man back and threw him in jail and brought back the debt he owed.

We want it one way - forgive me, but I wont forgive someone else. Our trials and accusations against us never changes our perseptions of others, whether they be straight trying to work in the gay industry or coworkers / peers.

So what has happened with my family now? My brother after not accepting his responsibility - has lost his job and has been out of work for 4 years, and even though he wronged me - I have kept him safe, living at my place and feeding him. As much wrong as he has done against me - I may have a larger debt owed to someone else in life. Since the situation with my niece, half my family wont be around for christmas.

I hope this christmas and new years we all can reassess our feelings of bitterness and hatred towards one another - whether it be someone who is straight - coworker - ex - whatever - karma will come knocking soon to your door, its up to you to make sure it finds you well and with good spirit to allow it in.

[basschick]

sounds very rough :-(

but forgiving someone who is not repentant, or who is continuing their inappropriate behaviour makes no sense. perhaps housing someone who is deliberately doing things to harm you and your relationships isn't so great, either.

maybe it's time to get you, your brother and your niece - or any other harmed or involved parties - to family counseling. be very honest even while you are caring. even if they won't come, perhaps other relatives are involved.

i don't expect anyone to forgive me for anything until i stop doing that thing, and also develop a new history with that person where i continue to not harm them. i don't sit around holding a grudge, but i see a lot of battered wives and hated adult children constantly forgive their abusers even as the abuse continues. it's easy to say "i'm sorry" and stop a behaviour for a week. it's re-establishing trust to say i'm sorry and stop that behaviour for six months.

i hope you can find some peace through your holidays.

[Lee]

Originally posted by basschick
forgiving someone who is not repentant, or who is continuing their inappropriate behaviour makes no sense. perhaps housing someone who is deliberately doing things to harm you and your relationships isn't so great, either.

I agree with you there 110% Patti, however, the issue arises, they may 'appear' to be repentant but that could only be a charade for the sake of those who are harboring the wrong doer.

There really isnt any way of knowing for sure however, a good way ensuring that no harms comes again is to ensure you dnt put yourself, family or, friends in a position to be harmed, whether in personal life or, specifically, in business.

Regards,

Lee

[CuriousToyBoy]

There sometimes is a very fine line between charity and stupidity.

In my experience, finding that fine line can be a challenge.

:biker:

[basschick]

lee - like i said in my post "it's easy to say "i'm sorry" and stop a behaviour for a week. it's re-establishing trust to say i'm sorry and stop that behaviour for six months."

no person can ever know the mind of another fully, but if someone stops a harmful pattern for a long time, i think that says a lot - if not about their feelings toward you, at least about their actions.

CuriousToyBoy - i don't know that the line is between charity and stupidity - it could be that you are not stupid, but were taught to revere family relationships even over your own well-being. it could be that the only way to protect children is to take care of the parents in some way - even though you feel the parents are not people you would help on your own.

[gaybucks_chip]

I think you can definitely forgive someone who isn't repentant... those are both the hardest people to forgive and perhaps the people that most need it... but there's a difference between forgiving and allowing the person to continue to shit on you.

There are people in my life who've wronged me who I've forgiven because I have compassion for them and feel for them... but I've also made sure that I can't get burned by them again.

For me, it's the best middle ground between compassion and being reasonable about protecting oneself.

[CuriousToyBoy]

Originally posted by basschick
CuriousToyBoy - i don't know that the line is between charity and stupidity - it could be that you are not stupid, but were taught to revere family relationships even over your own well-being. it could be that the only way to protect children is to take care of the parents in some way - even though you feel the parents are not people you would help on your own.

Those examples do NOT disprove my point.

They both fit into charity quite comfortably.

My point still stands.

:biker:

[TheLegacy]

Originally posted by boyfunk
I think you can definitely forgive someone who isn't repentant... those are both the hardest people to forgive and perhaps the people that most need it... but there's a difference between forgiving and allowing the person to continue to shit on you.

There are people in my life who've wronged me who I've forgiven because I have compassion for them and feel for them... but I've also made sure that I can't get burned by them again.

For me, it's the best middle ground between compassion and being reasonable about protecting oneself.

I remember back in the seminary - I had a wicked sarcasm - could tear anyone apart and often did to the delight of many. I had done this all through highschool. As I entered into the classroom early to get a good seat I spotted a girl I knew who appeared to be in tears.

After asking several times she finally admitted what I had said to her at lunch time hurt her greatly - so much - that she hadnt stopped crying. It was then i realized my words do have an impact on people, and I can either use them to encourage, or tear them down.

I had a decision based on what I was seeing in front of me - I could be cold hearted and turn off my emotions, or realize that my purpose in life is either to create evil or good. I choose good.

So when I speak of someone, I make a conscience attempt to speak good, and when a friend is being torn down by others, I will stand by them taking some of the heat as well - since that is what "goodness" does. Those who have wronged me in the past, I am a bit more careful with - but I must realize that I too have made mistakes, many - and I respected and received great blessing when someone was willing to give me another chance. I never abused it.

Its becoming more difficult these days to accept one anothers faults, and even more - success.

:santa:

Mistakes we make and accusations against us - if we cant forgive someone else who appears to have done the same, then do we really have the right to ask for it ourselves??

[basschick]

thelegacy - i'm not sure of whom you are speaking or what the situation is. i see meanness on the boards, but i sometimes see that it is not meanness but revealing what is perceived to be a truth. the person posting may be wrong, but they may see what they are posting not as being mean but as telling other webmasters something they need to know to protect their businesses.

there is a recent thread here about a content provider. he had a problem on his content, and a lot of people jumped up to defend him personally. he may be the world's nicest guy, but there really had been a problem with his content, and he really wasn't initially taking the responsibility to deal with it.

i was on the unpopular side of this thread - i feel content i pay for should have no surprises, and should not have anything that could cause my members to quit. it has nothing to do with who the feed provider is. i also came up with a solution to the problem.

your post sounds like you have a situation that you've personalized in mind. are you sure that the situation was personal?