National Coming Out Day

[Jasun]

Deslock, that's brillilant.

Can I use that?

[XXXWriterDude]

If No One Knows You Are Gay, you make bigots appear to be right about gays.......

GREAT post, storyman. I do think coming out is a VERY important thing for people to do (hey, Tom Cruise, are you listening? LOL!), but I also firmly believe that it's a decision that people have to make in their own time. Also, being in the entertainment industry, I acknowledge the importance of "silence" if you want to establish a successful career before THEN derailing it by coming out. (LOL! Kidding!) But let's face it: for folks like Tommy boy, coming out in the beginning of your career would immediately destroy your chances of "breaking through" to the mainstream, where you could potentially have the most influence. Melissa Etheridge and Ellen Degeneres timed their coming outs very smartly, and I applaud them for it.

That said, I think it's EXTREMELY important to have openly gay people who are out from the start. But the truth is, they make great role models chiefly for GAY kids who look up to such folks as role models.

I think it's important to have a balance of both, b/cuz social change has to be accomplished in both communities, not just in our own. And if you never have the opportunity to get to a point where you can influence people, you can never have the influence you might have had if you'd calculated it. Personally, I think it's kinda cool that people like Melissa and Ellen reached the point they wanted to reach in their careers, then said, "Haha, fooled you!"

[XXXWriterDude]

P.S. As a coda to my former post, I should also add that I hope that one day people won't have to "be silent" in order to break through to the masses. But people like Melissa and Ellen who did it that way are making it possible for many others to not have to do it the way they did it.

I get so angry when gay people say things like, "Yeah, but Melissa and Ellen perpetuated the idea that you have to lie in order to first be accepted," b/cuz that's not the case at all. If you look at it like that, then you're simply not seeing the bigger picture, which is that it takes all kinds of coming outs for us to truly make it OK to be gay. Melissa and Ellen are truly pioneers who realized that they would have the most influence if they first reached a much bigger fanbase than they would have if they'd been out from the start.

Of course, they also realized they could go further as entertainers if they did it that way. (Have to acknolwedge that, too.) But an entertainer's career choices are theirs to do with as they see fit, and none of us have the right to judge them for doing what they feel is best for their careers, b/cuz truthfully, nobody has an OBLIGATION to be a role model.

I've been out since I was 19, and have been extremely vocal about being gay in just about everything that I've done, b/cuz I WANTED to be someone who told other people it was OK to be gay and who you are. But not everyone wants that responsibility, and I feel they are equally deserving of our respect--even if they aren't doing what we might want them to do.

It's the same with ordinary people as well. It's a shame, but the reality is that being "out" is not always the best option for someone's career. And everyone is different in choosing how much abuse they want to put up with. Not everyone is built to be a role model. I think it takes a certain kind of person to stand up and say, "Hey, everyone, I'm gay. This is who I am."

[robin]

Melissa Etheridge and Ellen Degeneres are the primary people that influenced my decission to start the process, (and for me it was a drawn out process) of coming out.

[gaystoryman]

It's the same with ordinary people as well. It's a shame, but the reality is that being "out" is not always the best option for someone's career. And everyone is different in choosing how much abuse they want to put up with. Not everyone is built to be a role model. I think it takes a certain kind of person to stand up and say, "Hey, everyone, I'm gay. This is who I am."

But isn't the reality really not that it isn't good for a career but that is based on lack of tolerance & understanding, and the more people come out the greater the tolerance will rise?

How many gay football stars are there that are out?

Wouldn't more of them coming out refute the stereotype that gays are pansies? are not 'real men' and of course that comes with a price for those who pioneer it, like Jackie Robinson who took a lot of heat, but look at baseball today.

By saying its not a 'good career move' arent we giving in to the fear and the whole anti gay theme that there is in fact something dirty about being gay?

[basschick]

i'm bi, and my mom has known pretty much since i was 16 that i dated women as well as men. my friends knew, but then most of my friends were gay or bi, so i guess that's not amazing.

now i'm in a monogamous relationship with a man, but that doesn't make me straight. it's actually a little embarrassing to me, because now people assume i'm str8 - and believe it or not, some of us really ARE embarrassed to be str8.

i think that being gay or bi or trans can be dangerous - not just emotionally, but really dangerous. it's terrible that we live in a world where this is true, but i personally can't see pushing someone to come out.

on the one hand, i feel that letting the people who love or know you know who you really are makes the world a better place. also it's better not to live a lie, because it means you never feel the entire you is acceptable - and that is devestating to your self esteem. and you can be one more person letting the world know that being gay is NORMAL!

still, a national day dedicated to such a personal thing feels funny to me... but if it helps some people, it rocks.

[Happysucks]

Melissa Etheridge and Ellen Degeneres are the primary people that influenced my decission to start the process, (and for me it was a drawn out process) of coming out.

Clive Barker and Bob Paris for me

[XXXWriterDude]

But isn't the reality really not that it isn't good for a career but that is based on lack of tolerance & understanding, and the more people come out the greater the tolerance will rise?

That's ONE reality, yes. And that's an absolutely good point. But of course, look how many black people are public figures in the world, and look how much racism there still is toward them. I honestly think that no matter how many gay people come out, homophobia will never go away.

How many gay football stars are there that are out?

Wouldn't more of them coming out refute the stereotype that gays are pansies? are not 'real men' and of course that comes with a price for those who pioneer it, like Jackie Robinson who took a lot of heat, but look at baseball today.

Personally, if the world hasn't realized by now that not all gay men are pansies, then they're just plain ignorant and they're probably never going to know any different. And I also think that making a statement like that one--'not all gay men are pansies'--belies an internalized homophobia as well. Aren't we past this as well? Some gay men are pansies. It's funny. I used to have a knee-jerk reaction to nellie guys b/cuz I actually bought in to that self-hatred that the gay community likes to perpetuate through its incessant desire to show how "straight-acting" we can be too... but the irony is that once I started hanging with all the uber-macho guys at the uber-macho bars, I got really bored of them. About 50 percent of them are only play-acting macho b/cuz they think it's what will get them laid. And some of them are so fucking humorless when it comes to being gay that they end up being the most judgmental people you'll ever meet. Now when I meet a guy who gets all riled up about the queens who love Judy and Barbra and Madonna, I just go, "Well, smell you, Mr. Marlboro." The super irony is that now, the guys who are a little bit more flamboyant are actually starting to stand out to me, b/cuz in the increasingly "straight-acting" gay community, THEY are the ones who stand out. They are the ones who are just being themselves and who aren't so concerned with appearances.

I think we need to get past this whole maculine vs. feminine thing once and for all and accept the fact that the community is made up of all kinds of people. Isn't it bad enough that we have to deal with all the crap from the bigger world. But now we have to heap it upon each other as well?

This is not directed at you, gaystory, b/cuz I don't think you were actually making a judgement with your statement, but it did raise a concern with me, and I just wanted to comment on it.

By saying its not a 'good career move' arent we giving in to the fear and the whole anti gay theme that there is in fact something dirty about being gay?

No, I don't think that at all. I used to, but not anymore. I think some people who choose to stay in the closet are doing what they feel is best for themselves, and I don't think they're doing anything other than getting by the way they see fit. I think the whole "you're giving in to that" mentality is founded in unrealistic idealism and, frankly, unfair expectations of what we feel others should do. For some people, it's as simple as, "Look, I'm not making a political statement. I'm just living my own fucking life, so stay off my back."

See, I see both sides of the coin, and while I certainly understand the VERY IMPORTANT need for out gay role models, I also understand that there are all kinds of people in the world, and we don't all want to be gay martyrs for "the cause." And not everybody has to be. There will always be those who pick up the torch and carry it proudly (and sometimes a little too loudly), so we're not in danger of losing our voice in the world, but there will also be those who just kinda want to stay in the background and do their own thing. Not everyone is an activist. Not everybody can be a hero.

Yes, the more people who come out, the more tolerance will be on the rise, but again, the reality is that we don't live in a perfect world where idealism rules the day. People still get fired for being gay. Kids still get kicked out of the house by their parents for it. Some people even still kill themselves over it. I think the move toward an openly tolerant society is happening, but it takes a long time to get there, and yes, it takes a lot of people to make that happen. But in the meantime, in the here and now and back here on planet earth, a reality check will reveal that life isn't so black and white for all gay people.

[desslock]

Deslock, that's brillilant.

Can I use that?

hey, thanks Jasun! Sure why not.... I guess I took away some good speeches from my gay activism days in the 90s.

Steve