CCBill does, in fact, have a number of gay guys who work there, but they aren't out, and probably aren't in upper management either... Patrick mentioned this to me some time ago, and I sort of got the impression that perhaps it wasnt' quite as accepting a culture internally.

However, I have to say that Andy, our sales rep has been totally open and welcoming and I've never gotten even the slightest homophobic vibe from him.

I haven't found either the Epoch or CCBill process to be appreciably different in setting up -- both were easy for us -- but then again, we started processing with ccbill in 2002, so it may be more complex now.

BTW, dean, if you go with Epoch, I don't really see any reason to go with NATS over MPA3. If you were *paying* for MPA, I'd say get NATS instead -- lots of people have gone from MPA to NATS, but no one that I know of has gone NATS to MPA -- but if MPA is free with Epoch, I'd say go with that.

If we were in a different place and hadn't gone with NATS last year, we might well be considering the Epoch/MPA deal. The only thing that makes me uncomfortable is the REQUIREMENT that Epoch be first in the cascade. I mean, I completely understand it and think it's reasonable, given that the software is free, but I like the flexibility we have to change out processors on a whim if one is scrubbing too hard that day, or slow, or whatever... and Epoch doesn't allow that flexibility unless they are completely down. So that might make it worth paying for NATS if you're anal about redundancy. But other than that, I'd say the free MPA deal with Epoch is hard to beat.