Why No Gays at YP???

I just got back from the YNOT Party held in La Salina, Mexico this past weekend, and I was thoroughly disappointed to see that no gay webmasters were in attendance. I spoke with YNOT Bob, who said he would be ECSTATIC to see gay webmasters joining the caravan, so it's not like they're not open to it.

This is one of the most awesome webmaster gatherings I've been to yet. Four days and three nights in lovely Mexico at a resort right on the beach. Laid-back, relaxed, and totally conducive to really getting to know the webmasters. And cheap to boot!

I was the only gay guy there all weekend, but got along famously with most of the folks I met. I've been to a few shows now, and I think this was definitely my favorite, even without the presence of other gay folks. And that's saying something.

I would like to see more interaction between the gay and straight side of the industry. I think both sides can benefit from each other considerably.

I took lots of pics, both of the folks attending YP and also of the resort ground and of close-by Ensanada, which I really liked.

You can check them out here:

YP Pics: http://imageevent.com/lalalifer/ynotpartymexico06

Mexico Pics: http://imageevent.com/lalalifer/mytriptomexico

One of my coowrkers where there - From Python...And he had quite the time...Apparently one of his retailers had their Hummer stolen, and another guy almost got thrown in Jail. That's why the Gay's dont venture down there for shows, we're smarter than that! :P

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Originally Posted by D-Rock

One of my coowrkers where there - From Python...And he had quite the time...Apparently one of his retailers had their Hummer stolen, and another guy almost got thrown in Jail. That's why the Gay's dont venture down there for shows, we're smarter than that! :P

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That was Stephan (aka "Shaft")??? He was great. I hung out with him for most of the last night I was in town.

The Hummer was stolen b/cuz the guy was stupid enough to park it in the street in Ensanada instead of parking it in a patroled lot. I mean, DUH! You don't take a Hummer into Mexico and park it on the street.

One guy actually DID get thrown in jail. But there was actually a pretty good reason for that.

Anytime you travel to a different country, you have to be careful. Those who aren't usually find themselves in sticky situations. But the event rocked.

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

I just got back from the YNOT Party held in La Salina, Mexico this past weekend, and I was thoroughly disappointed to see that no gay webmasters were in attendance. I spoke with YNOT Bob, who said he would be ECSTATIC to see gay webmasters joining the caravan, so it's not like they're not open to it.

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There are a lot of great people involved with the Ynot board

but I found their board group mentality less then desirable, this was about 4-5 years ago. I haven't posted there since.

When I first started reaching out to other webmasters the first board I became a member of was the Ynot board. I didn't like the way people in our community were treated there, neither did others in our community, that is why GWW became my posting place after some bad experiences on Ynot.

This could be part of the reason you don't see others in the Gay community participating in Ynot events like the one you attended.

As far as the straight community and Gay community working together, I love that idea. I work with a lot of straight people and they're great. Assholes are just assholes no matter what their sexual orientation :groovy:

Interesting, Squirt. Bob seems really open to "the gays." :)

Here's the story I wrote on this year's YP: http://avnonline.com/index.php?Prima...tent_ID=276179

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

Interesting, Squirt. Bob seems really open to "the gays." :)

Here's the story I wrote on this year's YP: http://avnonline.com/index.php?Prima...tent_ID=276179

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How open was he Ken? Ha ha ha!

Bob always seemed like a laid back fun guy

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Originally Posted by Squirt

How open was he Ken? Ha ha ha!

Bob always seemed like a laid back fun guy

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LOL! Not as open as a few of those other guys that were there. If I'd just had ONE more night with them... :)

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

Why No Gays at YP???

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Did YNOT actually reach out to the gay webmaster community in anyway? This is the first time I've even heard of this particular event. And it's not going to do me a lot of good now since it's already past. ;)

Btw, I didn't see even one sponsor of the event who has a significant gay presence. So why would a gay webmaster have any interest in attending an event like this?

Yeah I never really got the impression they were all that gay friendly.

Michael

Why were there no gay marketers there?

Simple, because yet again, YNOT didnt post about the YP on any of the boards where gay companies or webmasters hang out.

Not to mention i feel the gay side of the industry is still reeling over the incident that happened on YNOT many years ago, i know a lot of people in the gay side of the industry feel YNOT are only interested in taking money from gay companies, in fact, they only ever promote 'sponsorships' to the gay market place for their San Diego show where they know there are a lot of 'us'.

Plus, based on previous shows, the gay attendance has been low (or non-existant) so what is the point in any of us turning up, if we cant do business with the individuals and companies we want to do business with?

Regards,

Lee

ken, isn't bob in glendale? if he wants to get to know gay webmasters, why doesn't he show up for the webmaster lunches? you've already discovered how accessible us l.a. webmasters are - and heck, we even have out of staters like chad and develish show up.

it's not enough to ask you to find us for him. a little involvement from the ynot folks would go a long way. i have been registered there since 97 (or possibly 96) and they've always seemed very clique-ish to me.

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Not to mention i feel the gay side of the industry is still reeling over the incident that happened on YNOT many years ago, i know a lot of people in the gay side of the industry feel YNOT are only interested in taking money from gay companies, in fact, they only ever promote 'sponsorships' to the gay market place for their San Diego show where they know there are a lot of 'us'.

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What happened a few years ago?

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That was Stephan (aka "Shaft")??? He was great. I hung out with him for most of the last night I was in town.

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Yep, it's Stafford actauly, ("Shaft")....He mentioned haning out with you, and said you were really fun!

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Originally Posted by D-Rock

What happened a few years ago?

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Long story, not worth going in to if you dont know the 'history' of adult as it wont mean anything to anyone except those in the know :)

Regards,

Lee

I went last year and I had a blast! I love all those guys!!

I'll put it to you this way:

Years ago, when I came out to my mother, she freaked out. She cried and cried and cried, and became very combative with me if I attempted to explain things to her. Eventually, as I realized that she was going to throw a fit every time I tried to mention anything about my sexuality, I stopped talking about it to her. But that was MY mistake. I should have stayed the course and stood my ground, b/cuz it only contributed to a huge gap in our relationship for several years. I told myself that she was the one who didn't want to know about it, when in fact, the truth was that I was the one who didn't want to talk about it or deal with it. It became a self-fulfilling prophecy that she would have problems with me, b/cuz in my avoidance and my silence, I made it seem like my life was something to be ashamed of or looked down upon.

I think it's a good example to bring up in this situation. The thing about straight people is that you have to train them. It's unfortunate, but that's the way it is. You have to show up at their events and act like you belong to be there just as much as anyone else, and you have to put yourself out there and just have fun. This past weekend, I was the ONLY gay person in attendance, and I had a fucking BLAST. They loved me. And I know that my presence and my ability to be "one of the guys" helped them to see beyond my sexuality.

You can sit around and say that YNOT is clique-ish, but honestly, the problem with gay people is that we are just as clique-ish. We get an idea in our heads that straight people don't want us around, so we just go off into our own little corner and only talk to each other or talk to the straight people that we're comfortable with. It's so easy for us to play the victim in every scenario, whether it be that we're not wanted at predominantly straight events or that Hollywood is out to get us by making allegedly non-flattering movies like Brokeback Mountain.

I think it would be cool, though, if more gay people moved out of their comfort zones and made the effort to reach out to those who, while they might not outwardly act as if they want us around, are still very much open to it.

By the way, YNOT Bob didn't put me up to this. He has no idea I'm even posting this. I'm not here to be a publicist for anyone. I only advocate the causes and events that I think are worthwhile, and YP is definitely one of them, based on my AWESOME experience this past weekend. :)

Ken.. we don't go because we've learned to spend our money where it makes sense.

There's a gay show in Phoenix in a week, we'll all be there. Why spend time and money going to a foreign country the week before to a show that you haven't been invited to and probably doesn't have anything to offer your business past the "It's so nice to have the gays here" said with a pat on the back?

YNOT is a straight site geared towards the straight market, and although our site converts amazing with straight men and bi curious men, none of the webmasters will touch us with a 10 foot pole.

Why bother?

actually i don't think we have to train straight people. if they decide they want involvement with us - or the "pink dollar" - let them come here and post, for chrissake. if they aren't ready to make a move like post here or go to a lunch, perhaps they really aren't interested enough.

this is business, not our personal lives. ynot wants us? way don't they just drop by for a courtesy visit?

I went to YP last year and made a ton of deals with straight cash companies with gay sites and several other deals. I was the only gay guy there and they were very nice to me. It was a great show for me.

you're with a straight company that has some gay sites.

besides, i'm sure they would be nice to anyone who goes to the shows - i'm sure they're nice people. it's just that imo when you are reaching out to a person or community, perhaps you should be the one to take the first real step. asking ken is like taking the safe route - why doesn't bob just come here and say hi and get to know everyone?

I actually worked for the Gay section of AEBN last year when I went and did gay deals. I will talk to Bob and tell him to come over and say hello. He's a great guy and a great friend!!

;)

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

We get an idea in our heads that straight people don't want us around, so we just go off into our own little corner and only talk to each other or talk to the straight people that we're comfortable with.

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I'm not sure what your experience has been but I've never felt like "straight people" don't want me around. How rediculous ( not you, but to feel that way ). I don't only talk to Gay people and very few select straight people how silly. I'm select about who I do business with, Gay or straight, that's just common sense.

What you're describing is a Gay person with an anxiety disorder or paranoid dillusions that "straight people" are out to get them.

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

It's so easy for us to play the victim in every scenario, whether it be that we're not wanted at predominantly straight events or that Hollywood is out to get us by making allegedly non-flattering movies like Brokeback Mountain.

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I liked Brokeback mountain :cowboy: :cowboy: It wasn't made as a Gay movie to relate to out Gay men. It was made to tug at the hearts of closeted Gay/bi men and that's a great thing and I know it's impacted many MANY peoples lives in a positive way. Not every movie with a Gay theme has to cater to the out Gay man.

I've never been to any webmaster events, Gay or straight, so I can't speak on that part of your post. But I can say there must be a reason all these Gay webmaster events have been created.

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

I think it would be cool, though, if more gay people moved out of their comfort zones and made the effort to reach out to those who, while they might not outwardly act as if they want us around, are still very much open to it.

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When I'm out with people, anyone regardless of their sexuality, if they "might not outwardly act as if they want" me around, why the hell would I be there and hang out with them? To beg to do business with them or something? That's stupid.

I post on GFY every now and then. I've tried posting on a lot of the other adult webmaster boards. The thing that draws me back to Gay based boards over and over again is the lack of respect for me as a human being because I'm Gay. The jokes, the comments, stuff like that. People are different in person and a lot of the people don't make the comments and jokes, but the ones who do are continually allowed to do so, without restraint and that's a real turnoff. I have more respect for myself then having to put up with idiots all the time that can't get past the thought of my dick being in there ass if they bend over. Or fantasizing that Gay = submissive nilly queen that does whatever they're told. fucking hell

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Originally Posted by basschick

asking ken is like taking the safe route - why doesn't bob just come here and say hi and get to know everyone?

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Patti, once again, NOBODY asked me to do anything. I really don't know where you're getting that idea. I started this thread of my own accord because I myself was really discouraged not to see any other gay people there when it was such a great time and something that I think gay people would love to be involved with. Bob has no idea I've even done it.

By the way, we need that picture of you ASAP, as in LAST WEEK! We're going to print any moment, and we don't have a current pic of you to run with your responses to our Women in the Industry cover story.

if no one asked you, how would you know if they want gay webmasters to be involved? someone must have said or hinted something.

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

Patti, once again, NOBODY asked me to do anything. I really don't know where you're getting that idea. I started this thread of my own accord because I myself was really discouraged not to see any other gay people there when it was such a great time and something that I think gay people would love to be involved with. Bob has no idea I've even done it.

By the way, we need that picture of you ASAP, as in LAST WEEK! We're going to print any moment, and we don't have a current pic of you to run with your responses to our Women in the Industry cover story.

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See Ken, I think maybe you don't understand why we go to shows.

I dont' go for a good time, although I often have one.

I go for business opprotunites and I go to make business contacts. I dont' see how anyone at the YNOT show could have helped Fratmen. Certainly the amount of webmasters who would be interested in getting signed up to Fratcash would be negligible, We've already got a feed and we dont' need a Pay Per View theater.

I go to gay shows or shows with a big gay presence to make myself available for gay webmasters who already promote us or are considering promoting us. I go to make contacts I can use, not hang out with nice people who I can have fun with.

We probably wont' go to Las Vegas this year again.. for much the same reason.. we spent more money than we made, and the networking opportunites were limited (although not by a lack of gay presence so much as a lack of places where people could congregate during the day). It was all partying in Vegas, and if I wanna party, I'll stay in WeHo.

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Originally Posted by basschick

if no one asked you, how would you know if they want gay webmasters to be involved? someone must have said or hinted something.

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Because I said to Bob, "Dude, where are all the gay people? It sucks being the only gay guy here." He laughed and was like, "I'd love to have gay people show up to this thing."

Dude?

you're like so california, ya know?

:D

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Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude

Because I said to Bob, "Dude, where are all the gay people? It sucks being the only gay guy here." He laughed and was like, "I'd love to have gay people show up to this thing."

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Hello everyone...
Thanks for the invite over Robert..

Thanks for the good words Ken...

And just for some clarification...the WYPD is not like any other *show*. Shoot, I hate to even call it a show. Its more like a get-together....there are no cell phones, no computers, just a four day *Burning Webmaster* event. :)

If Gay webmasters want to come, they would be welcome with open arms and shown just as much love and respect as any other Webmaster who comes...it really doesnt matter to me, age, sexual orientation, race, economic stature, whatever...there are no booths to impress, there are no seminars to stand out on, the conditions are all cheap and dirty...so whoever is there is welcome.

If you come looking to schedule a huge business meeting or deal...then dont come...if you are looking to find out more about the Industry, when the participants are broken down to their bare necessities and open to any conversation then come...

Whether its InterNext, Gay Phoenix Forum, or the WYPD...you get out of it what you put into it....

if you want to come...the please do...I would love to have you...if you dont want to come...then I still would love to get to know you at a future event...Will I get business out of it? Maybe, but at the least I will probably gain more info on how our Industry as a whole...not just gay or straight...is operating...

and the sum of all equations is what I like to know...not just the parts which make up the sum

You all have a great day...and if anyone wants to talk further, about anything...I prefer phone....

619.702.7911

take care, and thanks again Robert and Ken

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Originally Posted by Dzinerbear

Yeah I never really got the impression they were all that gay friendly.

Michael

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Gay Friendly? Good Lord gents! The Y Not board, not only has a forum for the gay community, it also doesn't stand for the bullshit name calling I see on every other "straight" board!

Thanks for that, Bob.

It sounds like it's just a party in Mexico.. which sounds fun.

Of course to play devil's advocate, I have to point out that striaght ccompanies are going to benefit more through the networking that's bound to happen over margaritas in the sun...

however, yeah.. it's cool to have it cleared up.

but may I suggest that you maybe try to promote it a bit more to the gay boards and try to get a few more of us there?

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Originally Posted by Jasun

but may I suggest that you maybe try to promote it a bit more to the gay boards and try to get a few more of us there?

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I'm all for Anything that will attract more gay web masters to events like YP! Our company's bread and butter comes from the gay end of our business, and I'm always attentive not to step on toes, cause you never know what's gona piss someone off. :catfight:

Anyway, this whole industry is so `nilla, it's a wonder they produce porn at all! $0.02

WOO HOO!

Thanx for posting, Bob. I have to admit, I'm feeling a little proud of myself right now that I started something that might possibly lead to more interaction between YNOT and the gay webmaster community. If you want people who know how to party, the gays have a corner market on it, buddy! :)

Madame, it was great finally getting to meet you at YP last weekend. Glad you recognized me. It was good to have a kindred spirit there, even if you didn't bring any hot gay boys along for me to fondle... I mean, get quotes from for my story. LOL!

YP is a party yeah, but it's not "just a party in Mexico," Jasun, or anyone else. Everyone knows that the BEST part about this industry is that we are able to do business while we are also having fun. That's what makes this business so special. We don't need to walk around in business attire and "take meetings" and be so formal; if you honestly want the business to get done, you will get the business done.

Personally, I think events like Internext in Vegas and Florida and events like YP are super-important to getting business done in this industry. Because of the informal nature of what we do (hello, it's PORN!), informal events such as YP are essential to us being able to put faces to the names and building strong, solid relationships with each other. Bob said it best in the quote in the story that I wrote about YP, so I'm gonig to repost that last paragraph here, because I think it says everything I am trying to convey in this thread:

Those who are skeptical about the relevance of such a loosely structured gathering might want to consider checking it out next year. “It definitely gets business done,” Rice claims. “Every year there’s a success story. Every year there’s a big program that comes out and blows up. I’ve seen a million images given away while sitting around drinking tequila. I’ve seen complete programs built and ideas generated. It’s unbelievable. It lets your guard down. They see who the real person is. You’re not wearing a tie. You’re walking around in your flip-flops, and you really get to know the person. And now that you know the person, you feel better about doing business with them.”

You can read the whole story here: http://avnonline.com/index.php?Prima...tent_ID=276179

Anyway, glad to see Bob posting here, and I hope everyone considers exploring this great avenue toward BETTER BUSINESS. :)

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Originally Posted by basschick

Dude?

you're like so california, ya know?

:D

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That's what happens when you grow up around straight guys in rural Pennsylvania. At heart, I'm really just a dude myself. :)