Non-recurring trials :(

lately i've been seeing a bunch of sites that seem to be owned by newbs that offer a non recurring trial option. funny thing is that most of these sites shouldn't offer a trial at all as they have so little to offer, but i think the owners are missing the point of a trial. if it doesn't recur, and your content isn't good, they won't be rejoining, so why not simply make a full month up front? or at least leave yourself with the option for a few guys to rebill.

every time i see this, i want to bang me head on the keyboard again and again.

i'll be posting this on a few boards hoping to reach the newbs who thought non recurring trials are a good idea.

I took your advice for ditching the trial and go with a full month (and recurring) and it works :D

Thanks, Patti

DEV...

You know I was just saying to Lee the other day, it's too bad that there isn't a proper webmaster school where people can go to learn shit like this. I know there are a couple of quasi boards/schools out there. But you'd think it would be in the billers best interests to run a physical school where you go and learn. This is an example of such a basic mistake.

Michael

A trial, non-recurring for what BASSCHICK? a week? Those darn newbees. Why do they find you BassChick?

I guess everyone thinks porn is now one of the few last fully USA manufactured exportable products.

There still remains an issue about a short trial for a paysite, they enjoying and being converted to a monthly subscriber. Rebilling has been our industry source of income, for both Program and affiliate.

There is the single month GET-IT-ALL - for a premium price, no rebilling.

Who wins? The program, when the person liked the experience and signs up directly.

they don't find me - i write reviews for a number of clients.

and believe me, the sites i'm talking about NO one would ever rejoin, so the site owners don't win. i reviewed one today with a non recurring 5 day trial that only offered 9 1-minute video clips and hasn't updated in over a month. i seriously doubt anyone will be rejoining :D

there are just enough pic sets to keep people from rebilling, but under 25 sets total and no updates. so i'm sure they'd make a lot more money dropping all trials.

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Originally Posted by wnc

A trial, non-recurring for what BASSCHICK? a week? Those darn newbees. Why do they find you BassChick?

I guess everyone thinks porn is now one of the few last fully USA manufactured exportable products.

There still remains an issue about a short trial for a paysite, they enjoying and being converted to a monthly subscriber. Rebilling has been our industry source of income, for both Program and affiliate.

There is the single month GET-IT-ALL - for a premium price, no rebilling.

Who wins? The program, when the person liked the experience and signs up directly.

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I talk to a lot of people wanting to setup new paysites and pretty much all of them tell me that they want to offer trials in order to get the PPS webmasters promoting their site when it launches.

The problem is, these people dont realize there is a difference between running a PPS site and a revshare site, in that PPS sites, typically speaking, are looking for traffic that they can trade to THEIR sponsors, rather than traffic that will join their site and make them recurring revenues.

Many programs offer $2.95 trials is also something else i hear a lot, these new site owners think that programs like ARS and TopBucks are making millions each year because they offer trials and their members areas retain..

Whilst some surfers will retain, the vast majority of trial membership joins cancell before the end of the trial, which is why many PPS sponsors load their members areas with feeds and not actual 'hosted' content, in addition to being packed with upsells, like the SicCash sites are, even before you hit the actual 'members' area.

The problem is though, even after explaining this to these want to be, new site owners, they just dont listen and find out relatively quickly that things how they think they should be working, isnt how things work.

Also, the same is true for new program owners wanting to keep their members areas clean, uncluttered and minimalistic, the problem is however that by designing a members area that way, the new member doesnt get a chance to see the FULL selection of content available so the sites appear to be void of content, even if its all there, but arranged 'nicely'.

Members of paysites want to see a 'busy' members area, they want to see as much as possible, as quickly as possible and for most, this means loading up the main index page inside the members area so that there is more content being displayed on it than the owner would want... Ive told several people this over the years and perhaps only 2 or 3 have actually listened to what i told them and implemented the changes... Only to notice their rebills and hold times increase, while those not implementing the changes, keep wondering why their site doesnt retain.. Even though they have thousands of pics, movies, etc, even exclusive content.

Regards,

Lee

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Originally Posted by Lee

Also, the same is true for new program owners wanting to keep their members areas clean, uncluttered and minimalistic, the problem is however that by designing a members area that way, the new member doesnt get a chance to see the FULL selection of content available so the sites appear to be void of content, even if its all there, but arranged 'nicely'.

Members of paysites want to see a 'busy' members area, they want to see as much as possible, as quickly as possible and for most, this means loading up the main index page inside the members area so that there is more content being displayed on it than the owner would want... Ive told several people this over the years and perhaps only 2 or 3 have actually listened to what i told them and implemented the changes... Only to notice their rebills and hold times increase, while those not implementing the changes, keep wondering why their site doesnt retain.. Even though they have thousands of pics, movies, etc, even exclusive content.

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We listened and along with some other minor changes that you suggested and some of our own, we saw our retention increase quite a bit. We still don't have any upsells and probably never will.

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Originally Posted by Xstr8guy

We listened and along with some other minor changes that you suggested and some of our own, we saw our retention increase quite a bit. We still don't have any upsells and probably never will.

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You were included in that '2 or 3' LOL

Regards,

Lee

Some of our former Fratmen have decided they wanted a bigger piece of a much smaller pie and went on to do their own sites.

They make every mistake they can and some I didn't even know you could make. It's really sad to see people who think porn is a hobby.

We've all seen programs that are so bad that I'm amazed most people just don't ask for refunds, let alone cancel their rebill.

Whats even more amazing is that new programs still do this...

http://forums.gaywidewebmasters.com/...ad.php?t=23906

Can anyone tell me what the program actually sells to surfers?

Regards,

Lee

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Originally Posted by Lee

Whats even more amazing is that new programs still do this...

http://forums.gaywidewebmasters.com/...ad.php?t=23906

Can anyone tell me what the program actually sells to surfers?

Regards,

Lee

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what the fuck is that site??? makes absolutely no sense to me.

The "We are opened" doesn't instill a great deal of confidence either.

Michael

it shouldn't take a rocket scientist to figures out that a short term non rebilling option is just plain stupid. but then again it takes all types.

i've read the comments about the logic of monthly recurring billing but what about sites that offer longer term non recurring options(ie 3 and 6 months etc). that doesn't seem to make much sense to me either.

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Originally Posted by Richard Craver

i've read the comments about the logic of monthly recurring billing but what about sites that offer longer term non recurring options(ie 3 and 6 months etc). that doesn't seem to make much sense to me either.

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3 and 6 month non rebilling is actually a REALLY good way for sites to generate income.

For example, my profit margins on Condom Cash on the 3 month memberships, even if they get cancelled, far outweigh the profit margins on month by month recurring, even if those members rebill for the same period of time.

Most members will actually forget they joined for 3-6 months and still act the same way they would if they had joined for 1 month, try and view as much content as they can in the first few days/weeks/month then either get bored with the site and want to move on to something new, or completely forget about their membership, including the updates and not bother logging in again. So you'll get a 3-6 month membership which the surfer uses like a regular monthly/trial membership.

With monthly members that rebill month after month, they at least come back to check out updates, etc, when someone joins with a multi-month membership, much like when any of us buy a new DVD, we'll watch it once and itll stay on the shelf for months/years before it gets watched again, surfers are no different when it comes to porn memberships.

The ones i dont get, are the multi-month memberships that rebill for another 3-6 months instead of rebilling at regular monthly after the initial period is over.

Regards,

Lee

i have a couple of friends who are doing a longer non-recurring trial, for example: $10.95 for a 15 day trial NON recurring. they say it works very well for them.

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Originally Posted by haganxy

i have a couple of friends who are doing a longer non-recurring trial, for example: $10.95 for a 15 day trial NON recurring. they say it works very well for them.

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It WILL do well for them .... Hopefully its just not on a tour that their affiliates are sending traffic to ....

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Originally Posted by ArmpitLover

It WILL do well for them .... Hopefully its just not on a tour that their affiliates are sending traffic to ....

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Exactly ;)

I see no reason to offer trials on revshare sites, they do nothing to improve a programs bottom line profits, or the programs affiliates.

Regards,

Lee

works very well for them? how could that be? virtually every guy who joins for that price would have joined for $24.95 non reucrring - and most would have joined recurring, leaving at least a few rebills from the sales.

your friends are exactly the kind of newbs i'm talking about. they won't get as many affilaites, because who really wants half of $10.95? and as far as the rest, i and several other webmasters i know have tsted it extremely and virtually every one of those guys would have joined for a full month for more. the very few who wouldn't are offset by the additional price of the sale so that every single site i've seen do this makes more money by doing nothing except removing that trial.

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Originally Posted by haganxy

i have a couple of friends who are doing a longer non-recurring trial, for example: $10.95 for a 15 day trial NON recurring. they say it works very well for them.

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we don't run non recurring trials, so i'm not sure what the intention behind the idea is.

i think they are trying to make it via larger volume of signups, as well as members' area upsells, and also getting the customer to come back as a recurring member after their initial membership is over.

the customer is not offered a trial membership option when they return to the site at a later time.

they won't have a larger volume of signups - i tested this on my own sites and on the sites of 6 other programs. in every case, it simply meant less money.

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Originally Posted by haganxy

we don't run non recurring trials, so i'm not sure what the intention behind the idea is.

i think they are trying to make it via larger volume of signups, as well as members' area upsells, and also getting the customer to come back as a recurring member after their initial membership is over.

the customer is not offered a trial membership option when they return to the site at a later time.

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