Quote Originally Posted by XXXWriterDude View Post
Everybody in this business makes shrewd business decisions based on what is best for THEIR bottom line, and for them to expect anything different from others is, to me, ludicrously hypocritical.
One can be a shrewd business operator AND work in ways that benefit the community as a whole, particularly in this business. There is a whole school of thought about this style of doing business, including some MBA programs that focus on that style of doing business, and many companies are discovering this. It requires a different mindset than most are used to, but to say it's ludicrous and hypocritical is not an accurate statement.

I'm sorry, folks, but all this "We're different b/cuz we're gay" nonsense needs to stop, because it's just not true.
I don't know who's said that. I've said that the gay adult community is a double minority and should, for the health of the community, make more effort to work together, but I've never said we're *different*, just that we, as a community, would be more successful if we band together rather than splinter.

In the end, AVN will be all the stronger for dealing with this situation in a mature way.
The mature way being to try to pretend that people aren't concerned, so you can ignore the issue and hope it will go away?

Look, the truth is that we chose the time that best suited our show, end of story.
And I have some beautiful oceanfront property in Arizona. :fool:

Besides, you've already said you don't speak for AVN, and that there were "other factors", at work, and there are some indicators that AVN was not even the primary decisionmaker on the date issue.

CCBill was not blind-sided, nor were there EVER any malicious intentions on AVN's part. To suggest anything to the contrary is simply ludicrous.
But wait, you keep saying you don't represent AVN's opinion. Has that changed?

Plain and simple, if there are underlying motives behind the scheduling of our GAYVN Retreat, they aren't AVN's.
That I am willing to believe.


Personally, I think CCBill was brilliant in how they handled this. And that's all I'm going to say about it.
I am also willing to believe this. But the parties who could verify that are being silent about it.

the truth is... if you want unity you happen, you have to practice it YOURSELF. You can't demand that others play by the rules if you aren't providing them with an example as well. Unity only comes through EVERYBODY working toward the goal.
Read back to the beginning of the threads, after the CCBill announcement. Several people were saying "Let's see what happens. Hopefully, Epoch and AVN will immediately work with CCBill and this could be OK for everyone."

Then, 2 weeks of silence from the parties most able to do something about unity.

It was the inaction of the people in a position to create unity that caused the uproar.

And when you post "authoritative" messages inferring that you know what's going on behind closed doors (when, in fact, you know diddly squat about what REALLY happened), you force people to take sides
Again, with few exceptions, people started posting initially to get answers. When none were forthcoming for a lengthy period, people started posting information from whatever sources were available, generally stated as such, because of a dearth of information from the very parties that would have the facts to present. Still, almost no such facts have been offered, and the ones that have strain credulity.

I thought the whole purpose of community was to work together to establish a unified whole. I thought community was about the absence of judgment and intolerance.
People can have healthy disagreements on issues and still share the same community with others. I have strong views on barebacking, and so do Tony and Cam. We clearly have different views, but I still respect them and appreciate their viewpoints and their right to express them. There are a bazillion other examples.

What's really going on here is not lack of community. It's that many in the community DO want to work together, DO want to understand the full picture, DO want everything to work out to everyone's advantage. If the parties that haven't addressed the issue that clearly concerns a number of people in the community want to solve the problem, all they need to do is communicate about it.

Nearly every problem on the planet could be solved if people came with open hearts and a genuine desire to work together for everyone's best benefit. This situation is no exception.

I do not like conflict, I do not like splintering, and I do not like making people angry, or being angry at others. I (and several others) have expressed willingness to discuss the issue, privately or publicly, get past the PR and spin, understand the truth (to the extent that there *is* a single truth, which may not be the case) and ensure that the information is disseminated as clearly as possible, without spin, and as much as possible, without any bias. Yet I haven't heard a word from anyone on the issue, and as far as I know, neither has anyone else who's made a similar offer.

This problem (or perceived problem, depending on your viewpoint) can be solved. It's up to the people who have been silent and/or disingenuous (and I do not single ANYONE out; this could include any of the players involved, or none at all) to open the doors and bring honest communication to the issue so it can be resolved. I'm confident that if everyone truly does desire unity within the community, it's possible, but it does require that everyone be willing to come to bat and work toward that goal.