Should Affiliate Program Owners Know The Basics Of The Business?

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10-23-2006, 10:56 AM
Lee

Should Affiliate Program Owners Know The Basics Of The Business?

So i was just reading a thread over on GFY where an affiliate owner didnt know what a 'free site' was and that made me think, if a program owner doesnt know what something as simple as a free site is, should they be running an affiliate program at all?

I mean c'mon, if you dont understand the terminology or mechanics of something so simple as a free site, then what is the point? You obviously dont know how your potential affiliates are going to be driving traffic to your program.

The other thing that i also thought of, if *I* as a program owner didnt know what a free site, tgp gallery, etc was, how could i possibly attempt to help one of my affiliates that were having trouble converting my sites?

Your thoughts? Should program owners at least have a basic understanding of the industry before launching their program?

Regards,

Lee
10-23-2006, 11:52 AM
Paco

Why am I not surprised that this would be turned in to a huge issue, when it is not! That would be no different from my posting the many dumb ass question from our affiliates about things I think they should know. Like what a fu_ _ing RAW is.

First, exactly why should a free site (FS) matter to a pay site & affiliate program owner/operator (unless they own/operate FS) ?
Does EVERY affiliate know or understand exactly what EVERY ONE OF their sponsors (or person the 'deal' with) does, or is doing? (Very doubtful! If you say yes: what EXACTLY is a CEP?)

Our affiliates use too many different ways to promote our product, which I am not going to bother learning about (unless I think the idea will generate good returns - not simply some earnings).

It’s beyond pathetic pointing and laughing at some person, especially when they themself are also in the dark (doing the exact same thing)!
(Guess they needed to make themself feel better about what they think they know.)

Oh, let me guess: it’s our job to know it all, not theirs!
10-23-2006, 01:58 PM
Bec

I think anyone launching a paysite should know about the various ways to market it. One of the first things I ask potential clients when they consult with me about setting up a paysite is "how will you market it?". Usually they say they'll setup an affiliate program ... and my answer/question is "if you suddenly have zero affiliates ... what would you do to move traffic to your program?" ... and they have no clue.

A program owner that doesn't have some understanding of the marketing process is really going to be hurting when deciding what tools to provide, how the various tools should look and behave and where they're used, and the kind of traffic that particular tool is designed to target. Buying traffic is only one of a multitude of methods to achieve exposure.
10-23-2006, 02:02 PM
gaybucks_chip

Interesting topic.

If a program owner is relying on affiliates for traffic, then he doesn't need to know all of the intricacies of traffic, but should have the basics down, just as an affiliate ought to have the basics of site operation, billing, etc. down.

I suspect that there are very few, if any, people in the business who are so well rounded that they really know all sides of the business equally well, but I do think it's important for larger program owners to have staff or contractors who can assist with aspects of the business so that the knowledge is at least available even if all of it isn't in-house.

For example, my former business partner Ryan was a graphic designer and did all of our banners, ads, site design, etc. Neither AJ nor I have those skills, so we contract out that part of the business, but I know enough to go in and make minor mods to the Photoshop files and HTML when needed.

Most of the midsized and even a couple of the larger programs I know have the same sort of concentration of knowledge; one large program is brilliant technically but not as strong with marketing, while another has amazing traffic thanks to the proprietor's knowledge, but the content isn't as strong as it can be.

The nice thing about this industry is that if everyone views it in the right way, there are really very few "competitors." Everyone can benefit from everyone else, so there is probably a lot more sharing of knowledge than in any other industry.
10-23-2006, 02:40 PM
Dzinerbear

I don't think a program owner necessarily has to know the basics of the business. Maybe their core competency is photographing hot guys and producing great content. So let them go ahead and do that, and let the webmasters do what they do best.

Of course, there is a trade-off, if a program owners doesn't know what a link list, TGP, free site, etc is, then they need to rely on webmasters to take care of those aspects. And they'll pay 50% of the membership fee. If they know those aspects of the biz and can afford to pay someone, they'll recuperate the cost of producing TGPs and free sites by claiming 100%.

I think it's not very different than a program owner knowing nothing about PHP or photographing content or writing and SEO. You do what you can and pay for the rest.

Michael
10-29-2006, 08:09 PM
Fister

It certainly helps both the sponsor and some affiliates when the sponsor has a good understanding of porn affiliate marketing. It probably makes no difference to affiliates who run their site as a hobby and not a business. I wonder what % of affiliate sales come from hobby affiliates.

I really like some of the sites from small-time operator gay sponsors who operate one or two paysites, but they often don't put enough work into affiliate tools. And sometimes they do things that are counterproductive, like offer only 25% rev share, have revenue leaks on the affiliates' tour pages, or even replace an affiliate's cookie with the sponsor's own cookie (believe it or not!)
10-29-2006, 08:39 PM
Xstr8guy

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaybucks_chip

... I suspect that there are very few, if any, people in the business who are so well rounded that they really know all sides of the business equally well...

Bec comes pretty darn close. ;)

Btw, I'm not so concerned about a sponsor knowing what a freesite, tgp, FHG or FPA is. It's hard enough to get sponsors to provide fresh banners in a variety of sizes. Some of my best sponsors haven't made any new banners in 3 years. And when they do, it's in some unusable weird size. C'mon sponsors, get off your butts!! New banners help sell your site.

One of my favorite sponsors, gunzblazing, makes new banners for every update. My only gripe about gunz is their big horizontal .gif banners... they look great but the first frame is all text... something about "our latest update". That gives the banner a VERY short life. And btw, the first (text) frame of animation lasts too long so a quick surfer may never see the second frame which is usually a great action shot.
10-30-2006, 12:42 PM
Paco

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xstr8guy

Bec comes pretty darn close. ;)
One of my favorite sponsors, gunzblazing, makes new banners for every update. My only gripe about gunz is their big horizontal .gif banners... they look great but the first frame is all text... something about "our latest update". That gives the banner a VERY short life. And btw, the first (text) frame of animation lasts too long so a quick surfer may never see the second frame which is usually a great action shot.

I always huck them (.gifs) in to ImageReady and redo the animation. Takes mere seconds (okay, maybe 60 of 'em).

My complaint is with the lack of balls many in the the industry have - no hardcore banners ... WTF (everybody is slowing removing them)!
Why even bother with a waring page if it's all softer than softcore?
10-30-2006, 09:21 PM
desslock

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee

So i was just reading a thread over on GFY where an affiliate owner didnt know what a 'free site' was and that made me think, if a program owner doesnt know what something as simple as a free site is, should they be running an affiliate program at all?

So what.... in fact, when I was filling out the application for the March Phoenix Forum this year, the following question really flummoxed me: "What kind of site do you have?" Fortunately I asked a friend, who told me to answer "Free Site"

So I'd been running friskyfans all this time without really thinking of it as such.

I actually find the industry's use of terms like "free site", "pay site" or "traffic"
to be lacking on many levels. Someone can be successful in this arena, and not be using this jargon.

Steve
10-31-2006, 06:02 AM
Madame0120

This industry doesn't have a standard set of terms, it's easy enough to be confused. What I watch out for is affiliate programs that redirect traffic, have bouncing e mails and/or never show up at events.
10-31-2006, 02:10 PM
XXXWriterDude

The answer to the question posed in this thread is a resounding YES. I think it should go without saying that an affiliate program manager should know--or show initiative for learning--the basics of the business. Isn't that just common sense?
10-31-2006, 03:05 PM
Paco

I was floored when I found out that the body shop (that I worked in) manger did not know how to straighten a frame (let alone what a sub-frame is), mix & accelerate a pint of 57P; pull and prep a dent, or even how to drive (parallel park 12 cars in an 8 car bay).

I was totally flabbergasted when I found out that a restaurant owner did not know how to prepare/butcher chicken; cook lobster; make béchamel or me a gin sangree while I showed him each.

I was outraged when I heard about people in this industry that do not know what an e-mail client is; how to write a proper subject line; how to design without a WYSIWYG; what RAWs are and the importance of stats, or worse, how to manage & "use" Windows, proficiently!

I chalk it all up to: it's not in their area, but as long as somebody there knows I am fine with that as I know and understand the purpose of acquiring "specialists".

My aunt manages a Safeway (grocer), and she does not know the temperatures that each product requires to stay fresh; how much yeast each type of bread requires; this months flavour of floor wax or how to run an alarm report to verify start and stop times.

Guess she needs to be fired!
11-01-2006, 04:29 AM
desslock

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madame0120

This industry doesn't have a standard set of terms, it's easy enough to be confused. What I watch out for is affiliate programs that redirect traffic, have bouncing e mails and/or never show up at events.

Good rules of thumb, Madame.

Steve
11-01-2006, 07:01 AM
Madame0120

Quote:

Originally Posted by desslock

Good rules of thumb, Madame.

Steve

Hey darlin' don't know what took me so long, but I added Frisky to my blog in the Gay Male Links area.

www.madamknows.com
11-01-2006, 08:45 AM
basschick

Paco - the body shop manager was a manager so managing is his first thing. an affiliate rep should make working with affiliate programs theirs.

Madame - there is a set of terms in our industry. tgp, fhg, fpa, mgp, whale and so on. part timers and newbs don't know 'em but all reps should. you don't make your program look good when you are asked if you offer fhg's and your reply is "what are they?"
11-01-2006, 11:54 AM
Paco

Quote:

Originally Posted by basschick

Paco - the body shop manager was a manager so managing is his first thing. an affiliate rep should make working with affiliate programs theirs.

I was actually trying to use some reverse psych.

However, now I've been started: a manager is to know all the tasks and operations other wise what is he managing --- staff that do something he/she has no clue about!
A manager MUST know each department, inside & out so, to ensure the staff are doing things efficiently and correct! Looks to me like the terms are backwards.

A -->company<-- representative (not a porn industry rep, as some like to think) should know their ... product (pay sites).
We had plenty of ideas that we took to others programs, and we were not offended that they did not understand our marketing campaign - we simply dropped the pretentious belief that they should have researched what we were approaching them with!

The assumption that a rep is to know everything about the industry is not a good one! Again, we are not repp'in the industry ... only OUR product!

If we are going to sit here and supply OUR definition of certain terms: why do people call themselves web "masters" when they can not do the basic and simple things, like design a site using notepad; can not code; can not generate an additional 500 RAWS a day; do not understand what portals and/or doorways are; do not understand he purpose to CEPs or the importance of word play?
After all, they are "masters".

I am not being serious with my thought of webmasters - I am merely trying to state just how equally ignorant some of the expectations held here are!

As far as I am concerned: a representative is to know everything about the product they offer. Anything over and above that is a bonus!

I spent a lot of MY time learning about this industry after I was thrown in to this position (not time or instruction given), so I am not protecting an ignorance I do not hold.
Free sites are the opposite of pay sites
DUH ;)

I simply think..
11-01-2006, 12:03 PM
Lee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paco

The assumption that a rep is to know everything about the industry is not a good one! Again, we are not repp'in the industry ... only OUR product!

Paco,

We arent talking about 'reps' though, we're talking about program owners they are two completely different things all together.

Yes, reps need to know more about their products than the 'industry' but a program owner, or affiliate support rep, needs to know about the industry in addition to their products.

Regards,

Lee
11-01-2006, 01:14 PM
Paco

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee

Paco,
We arent talking about 'reps' though, we're talking about program owners they are two completely different things all together.
Yes, reps need to know more about their products than the 'industry' but a program owner, or affiliate support rep, needs to know about the industry in addition to their products.
Regards,
Lee

Correct, Lee - my bad!
Sorry.
11-01-2006, 01:55 PM
Lee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paco

Correct, Lee - my bad!
Sorry.

No probs, it was actually nice seeing your 'other' side ;)

Regards,

Lee
11-01-2006, 02:31 PM
Paco

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee

No probs, it was actually nice seeing your 'other' side ;)
Regards,
Lee

hey - are you checking out my lumps, my lumps, my lovely latin lumps?
*wiggle wiggle*
11-01-2006, 02:53 PM
gaystoryman

and such lovely lumps too :jerkoff:
11-01-2006, 03:55 PM
Paco

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaystoryman

and such lovely lumps too :jerkoff:

Just make sure you do not miss that ribbed spot on the small of my back! Otherwise when I get off my fours it will not b-line through my cleavage, down the inside of my thigh before nesting between my cute lil' toes.

Thanks babe - I do spend a lot of time working them.