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I dont understand CCBill sometimes.
Sure, if a customer wants a refund in the first 24-48 hours thats understandable, annoying but understandable.
But 5 days after a member joins and has had a chance to download the entire members area, give me a fucking break.
Regards,
Lee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Wait till 3 weeks go by..I've had that happen several times.
Check the logs...might be fair enough if the member in question hasnt been logged in (password problems for instance)
If you have any questions as to why a customer was refunded please contact us at clientsupport@ccbill.com and we can answer any questions you may have.
We have techs waiting to assist you 24/7, 365 days a year.
I would still rather see a credit than a chargeback.
I wouldnt, a credit means the surfer can keep doing it over and over and over again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilihost
A chargeback means that surfer can never use that same card to join a site again.
Regards,
Lee
i think ccbill ( not speaking for them ) gives refunds no matter when if a surfer asks for it, sounds bad however ccbill probably does this since all the surfer has to do is dispute the charge with the credit card and they will get their money back anyway and ccbil wil be hit with a large chargeback fee. its a loose lose situation for us and ccbill.
these days credit card companies are so worried about identity theft and use of other peoples card information that they have swung to far to the side of the consumer, not even looking at logs of acess information because to them an ip adress is ajust a series of #'s it takes to long to cross refernace.
We protect ourselves by taking a very aggressive stance with regard to possible chargeback/refund situations. We closely monitor each membership and live cam sale. In our business, after many thousands of transactions the biggest flag is a woman's name on a credit card. Less then five of them have not been fraudulent charges. When we see one, we have 24 hours in which to contact the customer and confirm the charge. If the email bounces at once, we void the sale resulting in no chargeback and no refund. We also blacklist the email address, username and password as well as the cardnumber. It may be very unscientific but seems to work well. Our chargeback percentage is 019% or less then 1/5 of one percent.
Okay - lots of speculation - let's see if I can get into trouble...
CCBill has a rigid policy regarding refunds that is designed to prevent frivolous refunds and minimize credits. Our consumer support folks do everything in their power to protect your VALID sales, but if there is a valid, justified issue that a consumer has, then we will issue a refund when absolutely necessary – but only after making all attempts to fix the issue for your consumer.
We don’t just offer refunds because a surfer asks, that would be kinda dumb.
True, we don’t want chargebacks hitting us, but neither do you. Too many chargebacks are a detriment to your account history.
To your point, Lee, if the refund is granted due to a valid reason, wouldn’t you want that consumer to come back? If it was a password issue, they could come back and become a good customer. But if they resort to a chargeback, they are definitely a lost customer. And if a refund is granted due to fraud or a customer charges-back, that customer’s card is blocked from ever using CCBill for any site. So, you are protected.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Chargebacks and refunds both cost CCBill – we are one of the only adult processing companies that doesn’t hit our clients with chargeback fees. With refunds, we loose our revenue portion of the sale and still have to pay the fees for processing - but you don't pay any processing fees.
If I could speculate – I would think that if we only allowed chargebacks, we would possibly have to pass those fees along to our clients.
So they could get another 5 days access and ask for another refund?Quote:
Originally Posted by ccjax
No thanks ;)
Perhaps if there was a way that customer support could tell the client WHY a refund was issued that would help, normally if it is a problem with a user/pass not working ill get an email about it.
Regards,
Lee
We were with CCBill at first, as I'm sure most of you have read prior. Then we switched to Epoch. We don't do the primary / secondary stuff. We've dropped CCBill all together.
Anyways, CCBill is very bad at allowing chargebacks. I have a farely large network of 70+ membership sites in a network. We would get members who have purchased a 3 month membership. 60 days would pass with one month left on their membership. By that time they could have watched everything within our sites. And they would want to cancel. CCBill would allow them to create a chargeback. That's just one of the problems that I've had with CCBill.
The second problem that I had with CCBill was declines. I would receive 2-4 declines daily. CCBill would decline for the smallest reason. I would call CCBill via their support numbers, and they could never give me an answer of why they were declined. By that point, I had enough with CCBill but there were other reasons that I had left CCBill.
After finally having enough with CCBill, I dropped them and went to Epoch. Since I have joined Epoch, I have had 1 decline (the customer put in their credit card wrong), and the amount of declines from CCBill have of course dropped dramaticly.
Personally, I would suggest Epoch so much more than CCBill. Above are just some of my experiences.
Just putting in my 2 cents :-)
CCBill has nothing at all to do with chargebacks, any surfer can chargeback at their bank for any reason and there is nothing any of the processors can do about it unfortunately :(Quote:
Originally Posted by SebSloPro
As with Chargebacks, i have absolutely no gripes about declines, for the most part, declines are out of CCBills control, id rather have 100 declines a day because of invalid or do not auth cards, than 100 extra sales on those cards which would eventually result in a chargeback.Quote:
The second problem that I had with CCBill was declines. I would receive 2-4 declines daily. CCBill would decline for the smallest reason. I would call CCBill via their support numbers, and they could never give me an answer of why they were declined. By that point, I had enough with CCBill but there were other reasons that I had left CCBill.
Regards,
Lee
One additional point. Customers that want a refund generally come to us first. Most don't even understand the payment processor relationship. We will not authorize a refund without a phone conversation first. If the customer is polite and meets certain criteria we will offer them a refund which we issue ourselves. We try to avoid have our customers contact CCBill directly because I believe it is a lot harder for them to hollar 'gimmee my money back' to someone whose face they know than a customer service agent.
On the other hand, there is always going to be a nasty individual that will work the chargeback/refund system. I would rather a refund instead of chargeback anyday. We can blacklist them internally.
You didn't mention the fact that if it is an affiliate sale, you take a double hit on chargebacks. So here is our plan: the best customer service possible to cut off complaints that generate chargebacks and careful management of all affiliates.
Hi Lee,Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
There is. :)
All that information is detailed in the System5 Admin - all refunds and chargebacks, and detailed reasons for each one. It also outlines detail on every decline for your site.
In the Transactions section for refunds/chargebacks and the Analysis section for declines.
If you need help finding the reports - give me a call.
Thanks for the help with getting that refund reason report turned on for me in WebAdmin :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ccjax
It should have been turned on by default though hahaha ;)
The good thing is, now i know its available to me ill be able to check it out in future :)
Regards,
Lee
CCBill may show you what's happened with your account. However, it does not give the specific reason for it. It just shows you chargebacks and credits, anything relating to the finances of your CCBill.
What I want to know when I get chargebacks is WHY. Why did the customer call whomever it be their bank or CCBill Support to complain. Perhaps that may even better help us on our sites pertaining to what the customers or our "buyers" are looking for.
I'm not sure why we keep having this conversation every 16 days.
Michael
Sorry that you weren't aware that CCBill tracks all reasons for any credit/refund or void, as well as declines and chargebacks and we can provide detailed reports on the reasons WHY. It is good information that you need to have for your bottom line.Quote:
Originally Posted by SebSloPro
Anytime funds are 'impacted' in your account, we track the source.
It's all available to our clients.
You are wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by SebSloPro
I can now find out the EXACT reason of any refund, etc.
Regards,
Lee
[QUOTE=ccjax;220382]Okay - lots of speculation - let's see if I can get into trouble...
CCBill has a rigid policy regarding refunds that is designed to prevent frivolous refunds and minimize credits. Our consumer support folks do everything in their power to protect your VALID sales, but if there is a valid, justified issue that a consumer has, then we will issue a refund when absolutely necessary – but only after making all attempts to fix the issue for your consumer.
We don’t just offer refunds because a surfer asks, that would be kinda dumb.
[QUOTE]
I am honestly not trying to be insulting..but my experience over the last couple of years is that there is NO uniformity on policy when you call and talk to one of your support people. Some will say one thing, others will say different things. It truly is maddening from a webmaster's viewpoint when the support staff can contradict each other in just one phone call after another.
It seems that there used to be tighter ship support wise several years ago as opposed to how things are now. Sometimes I think the "management" really needs to have weekly meetings or something with your support staff to make SURE everyone is on the same page.
A quick "IMHO" post:
1) ccbill is a solid billing company with a reputation for paying out on time all the time for years, unlike probilling, pswbilling, acpay, etc, etc...
2) if you are unhappy, change billers! Its a free market, you are in charge of who you chose as your billing partners and there are other choices available.
Thanks for the honest, friendly feedback - I will pass your concerns along - Thanks...Quote:
Originally Posted by Mansized
If you don't work with a specific account rep at CCBill, feel free to use me as a resource, too.
But also, it is your business and your account, if you are not getting what you need, escalate your concerns up...you are the client...